Israel v Hamas

[Wisbech Eagle]

Most of the population support Hamas. They voted them all in 20 years ago.
Collateral damage to Hamas. You know we like life, they like death !

I don’t think that is remotely true now. Hamas started as an alternative to Fatah, who had failed in the eyes of the people to deliver safety and security. They weren’t then a terrorist organisation but morphed into one.

I would not expect a free vote to put them in power today. Any peaceful alternative being preferable. Most people there want exactly what we want. Only the extremists don’t.

 

[georgenorman]

I guess the Jew haters on here are sad to see some Israeli hostages returned to their families. It has upset Comrades Corbyn and McDonnell so much that they have probably broken the law by a coordinated effort to breach conditions imposed on a pro-Hamas rally.

 

[cryrst]

I don’t think that is remotely true now. Hamas started as an alternative to Fatah, who had failed in the eyes of the people to deliver safety and security. They weren’t then a terrorist organisation but morphed into one.

I would not expect a free vote to put them in power today. Any peaceful alternative being preferable. Most people there want exactly what we want. Only the extremists don’t.

But as we see and are finding out. It don’t matter what we want, as hmg are showing that they will continue to take decisions for us like Hamas will for them over there.
But you actually agree that’s the correct way so nothing to see here I guess.

 

[Wisbech Eagle]

I guess the Jew haters on here are sad to see some Israeli hostages returned to their families. It has upset Comrades Corbyn and McDonnell so much that they have probably broken the law by a coordinated effort to breach conditions imposed on a pro-Hamas rally.

Who do you think are “Jew haters” here? I don’t see any at all.

I see those who sympathise with the plight of the innocent victims of the war in Gaza. I see those who do not approve of Israel’s current government or its policies. There are plenty of Jewish people who feel the same way.

You can hate terrorism without hating Muslims.

You can hate Israeli governments without hating Jews.

 

[Wisbech Eagle]

But as we see and are finding out. It don’t matter what we want, as hmg are showing that they will continue to take decisions for us like Hamas will for them over there.
But you actually agree that’s the correct way so nothing to see here I guess.

Of course it’s the correct way here! We choose our government!

There haven’t been elections in Palestinian Territories for 15 years. So no democracy. No opportunity to replace Hamas.

 

[Penge Eagle]

Who do you think are “Jew haters” here? I don’t see any at all.

At least one poster on this topic believes the state of Israel should not have been created.

 

[Wisbech Eagle]

At least one poster on this topic believes the state of Israel should not have been created.

Being an anti-Zionist does not mean you are anti Jewish.

There is a perfectly respectable argument which says that there were better, less contentious, places to establish a Jewish homeland.

 

[Teddy Eagle]

Being an anti-Zionist does not mean you are anti Jewish.

There is a perfectly respectable argument which says that there were better, less contentious, places to establish a Jewish homeland.

Less contentious than the place they've lived for 4000 years.

 

[ASCPFC]

Being an anti-Zionist does not mean you are anti Jewish.

There is a perfectly respectable argument which says that there were better, less contentious, places to establish a Jewish homeland.

Madagascar was mooted at some stage.

 

[Spiderman]

Madagascar was mooted at some stage.

I preferred A Bugs Life

 

[Wisbech Eagle]

Less contentious than the place they've lived for 4000 years.

Untrue.

They conquered it 2000+ years ago only to lose it to the Muslims 1400 years ago.

It was only in the 20th century that the west, notably us, decided they could build their homeland there, without even consulting let alone securing the agreement of those who lived there.

Wars followed which resulted in a mass exodus of the Palestinian people.

So at worst both sides have a claim to the land so it was always going to be contentious, probably contested. So much easier to have found another solution, somewhere with plenty of space and less danger of creating the impasse and bloodshed we have now got.

 

[Teddy Eagle]

Untrue.

They conquered it 2000+ years ago only to lose it to the Muslims 1400 years ago.

It was only in the 20th century that the west, notably us, decided they could build their homeland there, without even consulting let alone securing the agreement of those who lived there.

Wars followed which resulted in a mass exodus of the Palestinian people.

So at worst both sides have a claim to the land so it was always going to be contentious, probably contested. So much easier to have found another solution, somewhere with plenty of space and less danger of creating the impasse and bloodshed we have now got.

So how is it untrue that they've lived there for 4000 years?

 

[Penge Eagle]

Being an anti-Zionist does not mean you are anti Jewish.

There is a perfectly respectable argument which says that there were better, less contentious, places to establish a Jewish homeland.

It's about absurd as saying, "I don't I hate Pakistanis, I'm just against them having a homeland."

 

[Wisbech Eagle]

It's about absurd as saying, "I don't I hate Pakistanis, I'm just against them having a homeland."

I don’t think anyone wished to deny the Jewish people a homeland.

Deciding where that should be is an entirely different question.

Where two, or more groups, have genuine claims to the same piece of land then to ride roughshod over one of them was always going to end in tears.

It could, and should, have been avoided.

 

[Wisbech Eagle]

So how is it untrue that they've lived there for 4000 years?

Many tribes lived in that general area 4000 years ago, and have over the centuries. Do they all have the right to establish homelands there? The Palestinians were the ones in occupation when the State of Israel was determined. Their rights have been ignored. It was a recipe for a disaster.

 

[ASCPFC]

It's about absurd as saying, "I don't I hate Pakistanis, I'm just against them having a homeland."

I suppose we could ask most Indians.

 

[Teddy Eagle]

Many tribes lived in that general area 4000 years ago, and have over the centuries. Do they all have the right to establish homelands there? The Palestinians were the ones in occupation when the State of Israel was determined. Their rights have been ignored. It was a recipe for a disaster.

That doesn't make it untrue.

 

[cryrst]

I don’t think anyone wished to deny the Jewish people a homeland.

Deciding where that should be is an entirely different question.

Where two, or more groups, have genuine claims to the same piece of land then to ride roughshod over one of them was always going to end in tears.

It could, and should, have been avoided.

Have you looked at a map of how tiny Israel is and it is surrounded by its enemies. All those years ago I’m sure they were unable to Google “best places on earth to form a country, without every surrounding country wanting to kill you because you are a Jew”!

 

[Penge Eagle]

I don’t think anyone wished to deny the Jewish people a homeland.

They have on this thread and many openly admit it. Open your eyes.

If you personally believe in Jews having a homeland, that makes you a Zionist.

 

[Wisbech Eagle]

That doesn't make it untrue.

Perhaps not but it makes the claim both unreasonable and untenable.

If a multitude of claims exist then they cannot all be satisfied. Compromise is required. The current Israeli government doesn’t do compromise.