Is Glasner the problem?

[IMMER PALACE]

I say stick with him. He should steer us to safety as long as we don't suffer horrendous injury problems. Yes - he will make mistakes, but give the fella a chance. He is not Vieira and he is not Roy - he is somewhere in between. Mind you, Parish gave Warnock the bullet after a Christmas defeat to Southampton.... just saying.

 

[JHB]

I say stick with him. He should steer us to safety as long as we don't suffer horrendous injury problems. Yes - he will make mistakes, but give the fella a chance. He is not Vieira and he is not Roy - he is somewhere in between. Mind you, Parish gave Warnock the bullet after a Christmas defeat to Southampton.... just saying.

The club is definitely giving him a chance. They’ve been much more patient than Leicester have with Cooper for example. I think he needs at least another couple of League wins between now and Christmas otherwise I think Parish will pull the trigger.

 

[MrRobbo]

We'll have to agree to disagree.
The decisions haven't worked,and for you that's fine as 'he had his reasons,' for his choices.
By way of balance, I was concerned when he first played Clyne on the right of the back 3 last season and yet it worked brilliantly.
When the decisions/ choices don't work it seems odd to persist with them though.

Yeah thats cool. I suspect we could go back and forth all night!

I just feel that there are so many variables in this sport its hard to be completely definitive about something 100% working or 100% not working.

3 points on Sat would be a welcome boost to all!

 

[Palacesince64]

We'll have to agree to disagree.
The decisions haven't worked,and for you that's fine as 'he had his reasons,' for his choices.
By way of balance, I was concerned when he first played Clyne on the right of the back 3 last season and yet it worked brilliantly.
When the decisions/ choices don't work it seems odd to persist with them though.

Sarr has played on the left in quite a few occasions for his previous teams. Given he is very right footed, when he plays on the right he looks to go past his man and cross most of the time. When he plays on the left he’s more likely to come inside on his right foot and shoot. It also creates space for Mitchell to overlap.

 

[PatrickA]

Sarr has played on the left in quite a few occasions for his previous teams. Given he is very right footed, when he plays on the right he looks to go past his man and cross most of the time. When he plays on the left he’s more likely to come inside on his right foot and shoot. It also creates space for Mitchell to overlap.

This must be incorrect then!
It has him everywhere in the forward line except on the left.
In fairness I do remember him featuring occasionally on the left for Watford, but very rarely.
He's made his name as a rampaging right winger with lots of pace .

 

[Lanzo-Ad]

Do Coppell and Allison bear any similarity to Moyes in managerial style? Plenty of other managers have taken us down, why pick them?

Coppell in particular is regarded as our best ever manager 3rd in the top league and an FA cup final. not to be associated with 1905est,s assessment of Moyes one bad season at Sunderland

 

[Lanzo-Ad]

I hope we beat Newcastle on Saturday, and Glasner is carried shoulder high as the future of a new phase of Palace change of direction, but time will tell if this correct, i hope it is.

 

[Painter]

I cant be bothered to keep banging the drum, but this binary view of correct/incorrect is such an oversimplified way of looking at things.

The fact that Glasner is tinkering, shows that he is at least, open to changing things that dont work. But lets also have a bit of trust in the reasons behind the decisions.

e.g. if he played Sarr on the left against Fulham, there must have been a reason, e.g. a tactical plan (exploit a fullback that pushes forward etc) He wont have just done it for a laugh. To say its incorrect is such a binary way of looking at it. I suspect if you asked Glasner he'd offer a more articulate reason, maybe we were on the back foot more that expected so Sarr's starting position was deeper than he wanted, perhaps we had opportunities to release him but the pass wasn't executed, perhaps even if Sarr didnt perform any standout moments he's presence kept Iwobi and Tete from pushing too far forward.

Football is a way more dynamic game, then you are giving it credit for.

How many times have our managers been accused of not having a plan B? Now Glasner starts changing things people complain, you couldn't make it up.

 

[Palacesince64]

I hope we beat Newcastle on Saturday, and Glasner is carried shoulder high as the future of a new phase of Palace change of direction, but time will tell if this correct, i hope it is.

I hope so too. Then maybe Happy Lanzo will put in an appearance. No need to eat humble pie just say something positive about Glasner and his tactics.

 

[est1905]

What I just cannot get on here is the fierce criticism of decisions he makes when none of us have the information that he has.
Lets say hypothetically that a first choice regular has a minor health issue like a cold and though they are fit are not quite 100% Or maybe they have suffered a bereavement of a loved one and dont feel in the right frame of mind to play even though they are physically fit. They may want this issue to remain private because lets face it, its none of our business. Say then that Glasner has to make a change to that position. Someone none of us would choose as first choice for that spot but there may be few other options and that player is being a team player and agreeing to do a job.

Because people on here dont know the reasons its (with some) an immediate excuse to sharpen the knives for Glasner. He doesn't owe any of us an explanation as to why he makes the decisions he does but you can bet there will ALWAYS be a reason. I said the same when people moaned about Roy and back then I wanted Roy replaced but could still see that he saw the whole picture and we dont.
Its not just about circumstances I've just described. Its also that Glasner is on the training ground every day with these guys. He knows what they are capable of. The buck stops with the guy that picks the team and rightly so. You cant have it both ways though. You cant lay 100% of the blame at Glasner's door when we lose if you're only willing to credit the players or cry fluke when we win.

Some total rubbish has been claimed about how 'he's been figured out' yet Emery didn't read that memo did he? nor Ange, nor any other manager this season in games where our performances deserved more than we got. Theres been a few too.

 

[Canterbury Palace]

I'm completely supportive of him. It's been a grim start to the season but I'm confident we're beginning to turn it around.

The end of last season was as good as I've ever seen us play I think, felt like we'd beat every team we played.

We're only 11 points off sixth and whilst I'm not suggesting for a minute we'll do anything like that, my point is that it's a condensed table and if we suddenly go on a run we'll climb the table quickly.

Get him a specialist LWB and RW (Ideally Cherki) in the Jan window and we'll be fine.

 

[JHB]

What I just cannot get on here is the fierce criticism of decisions he makes when none of us have the information that he has.
Lets say hypothetically that a first choice regular has a minor health issue like a cold and though they are fit are not quite 100% Or maybe they have suffered a bereavement of a loved one and dont feel in the right frame of mind to play even though they are physically fit. They may want this issue to remain private because lets face it, its none of our business. Say then that Glasner has to make a change to that position. Someone none of us would choose as first choice for that spot but there may be few other options and that player is being a team player and agreeing to do a job.

Because people on here dont know the reasons its (with some) an immediate excuse to sharpen the knives for Glasner. He doesn't owe any of us an explanation as to why he makes the decisions he does but you can bet there will ALWAYS be a reason. I said the same when people moaned about Roy and back then I wanted Roy replaced but could still see that he saw the whole picture and we dont.
Its not just about circumstances I've just described. Its also that Glasner is on the training ground every day with these guys. He knows what they are capable of. The buck stops with the guy that picks the team and rightly so. You cant have it both ways though. You cant lay 100% of the blame at Glasner's door when we lose if you're only willing to credit the players or cry fluke when we win.

Some total rubbish has been claimed about how 'he's been figured out' yet Emery didn't read that memo did he? nor Ange, nor any other manager this season in games where our performances deserved more than we got. Theres been a few too.

I agree with this to an extent. We don’t know what goes on behind the scenes. It also appears the squad is behind him which suggests they understand his reasons and methods.

For me it’s not the methods it’s the results. At the end of the day regardless of what is going on it’s points that matter when you a third of the way into the season. While we’ve been competitive in a few games I can only point to Spurs where we were clearly the better team. Hopefully that changes in the next few games but our safety margin is already used up

 

[Lanzo-Ad]

What I just cannot get on here is the fierce criticism of decisions he makes when none of us have the information that he has.
Lets say hypothetically that a first choice regular has a minor health issue like a cold and though they are fit are not quite 100% Or maybe they have suffered a bereavement of a loved one and dont feel in the right frame of mind to play even though they are physically fit. They may want this issue to remain private because lets face it, its none of our business. Say then that Glasner has to make a change to that position. Someone none of us would choose as first choice for that spot but there may be few other options and that player is being a team player and agreeing to do a job.

Because people on here dont know the reasons its (with some) an immediate excuse to sharpen the knives for Glasner. He doesn't owe any of us an explanation as to why he makes the decisions he does but you can bet there will ALWAYS be a reason. I said the same when people moaned about Roy and back then I wanted Roy replaced but could still see that he saw the whole picture and we dont.
Its not just about circumstances I've just described. Its also that Glasner is on the training ground every day with these guys. He knows what they are capable of. The buck stops with the guy that picks the team and rightly so. You cant have it both ways though. You cant lay 100% of the blame at Glasner's door when we lose if you're only willing to credit the players or cry fluke when we win.

Some total rubbish has been claimed about how 'he's been figured out' yet Emery didn't read that memo did he? nor Ange, nor any other manager this season in games where our performances deserved more than we got. Theres been a few too.

Blimey, you cant alf rabbit.

 

[Palacesince64]

Blimey, you cant alf rabbit.

Hmmm. Pots and kettles come to mind!

 

[NMPalace]

I cant be bothered to keep banging the drum, but this binary view of correct/incorrect is such an oversimplified way of looking at things.

The fact that Glasner is tinkering, shows that he is at least, open to changing things that dont work. But lets also have a bit of trust in the reasons behind the decisions.

e.g. if he played Sarr on the left against Fulham, there must have been a reason, e.g. a tactical plan (exploit a fullback that pushes forward etc) He wont have just done it for a laugh. To say its incorrect is such a binary way of looking at it. I suspect if you asked Glasner he'd offer a more articulate reason, maybe we were on the back foot more that expected so Sarr's starting position was deeper than he wanted, perhaps we had opportunities to release him but the pass wasn't executed, perhaps even if Sarr didnt perform any standout moments he's presence kept Iwobi and Tete from pushing too far forward.

Football is a way more dynamic game, then you are giving it credit for.

Have to say i'm with Patrick on this one. I like OG and want him to succeed but some of his decisions have been bizarre.
For example Kamada was played in CM at a near reserve QPR in the cup and failed to make any impression. Yet the next game there he was in the same position and just as ineffective.
Your comment on Sarr on the left is also just wrong - there must have been a reason, yes you are right. With limited choices available to play his preferred 3421 formation he had 2 right footed senior players available , Sarr and Kamada. So one had to play on the left. I think it is as simple as that.

 

[NEILLO]

Have to say i'm with Patrick on this one. I like OG and want him to succeed but some of his decisions have been bizarre.
For example Kamada was played in CM at a near reserve QPR in the cup and failed to make any impression. Yet the next game there he was in the same position and just as ineffective.
Your comment on Sarr on the left is also just wrong - there must have been a reason, yes you are right. With limited choices available to play his preferred 3421 formation he had 2 right footed senior players available , Sarr and Kamada. So one had to play on the left. I think it is as simple as that.

To be fair, as a coach you don’t give up on a player after just one game. So I get Kamada retaining his place .
However it’s also fair to say that Kamada has been a huge disappointment and it’s hard to see where he goes from here after he returns from his suspension

 

[MrRobbo]

Have to say i'm with Patrick on this one. I like OG and want him to succeed but some of his decisions have been bizarre.
For example Kamada was played in CM at a near reserve QPR in the cup and failed to make any impression. Yet the next game there he was in the same position and just as ineffective.
Your comment on Sarr on the left is also just wrong - there must have been a reason, yes you are right. With limited choices available to play his preferred 3421 formation he had 2 right footed senior players available , Sarr and Kamada. So one had to play on the left. I think it is as simple as that.

I really don't want to be getting into defending stuff that either, is indefensible, or I don't actually agree with.

But whats the rub here, Glasner is so stupid that the common fan (who's done zero research on the oppo, hasn't trained with players all week has no coaching badges) can pick the team better than he can, and see when stuff isn't working before he can? Give over.

I'm humble enough to know that the game is complex, and fluid. And the coaches and analysts are looking at/for stuff that I have no idea about. And that some stuff that might look ineffective to us, could:

1. Be really close to having worked e.g. got in the right position but fluffed a pass. All the fans see is that he fluffed the pass, but might not appreciate the fact that he was there etc
   1. (Pretty sure there was a game that I thought at face value Nketiah was shite, but in the studio after they showed a stat on the number of sprints in behind, and said that he was doing a really important role for the team by getting there back line to drop. Just made a few silly mistakes in good positions)
2. Have a positive knock on impact that isn't easily visible e.g. DK, may have been preferred to Hughes or Lerma because of the perceived balance of him and Wharton (I think Lerma started against QPR, OG might has had issue with Lerma?)
3. Things that fans want to see, which aren't always right e.g. the average fan loves a striker charging down a CB, but if you've been exposed of any reasonable level of coaching you'd know that pressure is much more tactical, and the intention is usually to force the ball in a certain direction to try and win in a few passes into the press

So in summary, I don't think OG has/will get everything right. And it's ok to question decisions.

But keep in mind that even though we go to games, we are still fans with pretty low football IQs. So this constant demand for him to 'change the formation because it OBVIOUSLY isn't working' or 'Sarr cant play on the left' etc is a tad ignorant 🙂

 

[JHB]

I really don't want to be getting into defending stuff that either, is indefensible, or I don't actually agree with.

But whats the rub here, Glasner is so stupid that the common fan (who's done zero research on the oppo, hasn't trained with players all week has no coaching badges) can pick the team better than he can, and see when stuff isn't working before he can? Give over.

I'm humble enough to know that the game is complex, and fluid. And the coaches and analysts are looking at/for stuff that I have no idea about. And that some stuff that might look ineffective to us, could:

1. Be really close to having worked e.g. got in the right position but fluffed a pass. All the fans see is that he fluffed the pass, but might not appreciate the fact that he was there etc
   1. (Pretty sure there was a game that I thought at face value Nketiah was shite, but in the studio after they showed a stat on the number of sprints in behind, and said that he was doing a really important role for the team by getting there back line to drop. Just made a few silly mistakes in good positions)
2. Have a positive knock on impact that isn't easily visible e.g. DK, may have been preferred to Hughes or Lerma because of the perceived balance of him and Wharton (I think Lerma started against QPR, OG might has had issue with Lerma?)
3. Things that fans want to see, which aren't always right e.g. the average fan loves a striker charging down a CB, but if you've been exposed of any reasonable level of coaching you'd know that pressure is much more tactical, and the intention is usually to force the ball in a certain direction to try and win in a few passes into the press

So in summary, I don't think OG has/will get everything right. And it's ok to question decisions.

But keep in mind that even though we go to games, we are still fans with pretty low football IQs. So this constant demand for him to 'change the formation because it OBVIOUSLY isn't working' or 'Sarr cant play on the left' etc is a tad ignorant 🙂

As I’ve said elsewhere it’s a balance. Glasner clearly knows more about football than the vast majority of people. That’s why he’s paid lots of money to manage a football team. On the other hand the test isn’t really if he knows more than us. It’s whether his football IQ is better than other managers in his sample set. So far this season you could argue his football IQ is worse than 17 other Premier League managers which is what matters in the end

 

[MrRobbo]

As I’ve said elsewhere it’s a balance. Glasner clearly knows more about football than the vast majority of people. That’s why he’s paid lots of money to manage a football team. On the other hand the test isn’t really if he knows more than us. It’s whether his football IQ is better than other managers in his sample set. So far this season you could argue his football IQ is worse than 17 other Premier League managers which is what matters in the end

I didn't say it was a test to see who knows the most. He clearly knows better than us. My irritation is at the constant 'cant Glasner see that Sarr cant play on the left' chat implying he's an idiot, or that he's happy to play the 'wrong' formation every week.

You could argue bottom 3 football IQ, but again, a very binary view. Football IQ thats just part of it. Strength of squad, fitness, suspensions etc.

 

[JHB]

I didn't say it was a test to see who knows the most. He clearly knows better than us. My irritation is at the constant 'cant Glasner see that Sarr cant play on the left' chat implying he's an idiot, or that he's happy to play the 'wrong' formation every week.

You could argue bottom 3 football IQ, but again, a very binary view. Football IQ thats just part of it. Strength of squad, fitness, suspensions etc.

Yes that’s why I said you could argue it rather than being definitive. What is unarguable is that he hasn’t delivered enough points this season. Lots of potential reasons for this but ultimately it is what matters. Let’s hope he can garner more points now he will have most of his squad available. Unfortunately for Glasner, rightly or wrongly, his room for error has run out. We either start delivering (let’s all hope we do) or we have to try something different.