Is Glasner the problem?

[Palace Old Geezer]

Revealed: How Crystal Palace's £230m bidders are being funded

Mail Sport exclusively revealed last month that Sportsbank are among the bidders for current co-owner John Textor's 45 percent share in the Selhurst Park club.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Looks like Ollie may have some cash to splash come January if this deal goes though. If so, we have to hope he and Dougie buy wisely.

 

[JHB]

I disagree re Andersen. There is no way the club were going to make Andersen the highest paid player at Palace - and rightly so. Nor were they going to give the player a 5 year contract at the age of 28 - again, rightly so.

Finally, we don't have the budget of a Ferrari, so we aren't going to compete with clubs who either do have such a budget or who are desperate to make a noise in the here and now and damn the consequences.

I wasn’t suggesting we do have the budget of a Ferrari. I was saying one of the reasons we struggle to progress is this fact. As you’ve said if others are willing and able to invest more they will overtake us as they are doing.

 

[dreamwaverider]

We spend within our means.

Refusing to put a 28yo on a £150k 5 year contract isn't being tight, its being sensible. He'll spend the last 2 years of that contract sat on the bench.

I expect more likely in Saudi by then.

 

[est1905]

Use your eyes, forget the Mickey Mouse Europa league, he plays completely opposite to the way we should be, we have mid table players but relegation tactics, play narrow not expansive, don’t leave massive gaps between defenders and the midfield, he will relegate as all by himself, he doesn’t need any help, I can remember it took ages including the board to see how useless Vieira was, it’s Groundhog Day 😞

Firstly this has to be the stupidest comment that I've ever read on here and I've read some stupid ones over the years. Its the second biggest European competition. They beat Betis, Leipzig, Barcelona amongst others on the way to winning it. It is a very hard competition to win and if you were to ask any top class manager what competition they'd like to win if they cannot win the CL and their first answer would be the Premiership. Their second would be the Europa League. You either have no knowledge of this competition and think it is the Conference League which West Ham won (it isn't) or you are just dismissing the second biggest European domestic cup as if its nothing.
Secondly, why? You said 'forget the Micky Mouse Europa League'. I ask you why should we forget it? Because you dont want to acknowledge that he won it? That you dont think it is relevant to this discussion? Maybe because you have just decided you dont want any massive achievements brought up from his CV because God forbid that might look like he knows what he's doing.

 

[est1905]

David Moyes is what i would choose as manager, 6 seasons at West Ham, 12 seasons at Everton, even his one year at Man Utd they finished seventh, 19 years in the Premier, 18 at middle of the table sides, no relegations with either, best finish 4th, worst 17th, i would willingly accept 17th this season

He took Sunderland down

 

[Lanzo-Ad]

Revealed: How Crystal Palace's £230m bidders are being funded

Mail Sport exclusively revealed last month that Sportsbank are among the bidders for current co-owner John Textor's 45 percent share in the Selhurst Park club.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Looks like Ollie may have some cash to splash come January if this deal goes though. If so, we have to hope he and Dougie buy wisely.

He will be long gone by then 😉

 

[Lanzo-Ad]

Firstly this has to be the stupidest comment that I've ever read on here and I've read some stupid ones over the years. Its the second biggest European competition. They beat Betis, Leipzig, Barcelona amongst others on the way to winning it. It is a very hard competition to win and if you were to ask any top class manager what competition they'd like to win if they cannot win the CL and their first answer would be the Premiership. Their second would be the Europa League. You either have no knowledge of this competition and think it is the Conference League which West Ham won (it isn't) or you are just dismissing the second biggest European domestic cup as if its nothing.
Secondly, why? You said 'forget the Micky Mouse Europa League'. I ask you why should we forget it? Because you dont want to acknowledge that he won it? That you dont think it is relevant to this discussion? Maybe because you have just decided you dont want any massive achievements brought up from his CV because God forbid that might look like he knows what he's doing.

Do you think Any of the above teams put there first team out, well they didnt, had a bit more sense than our thicko.

 

[est1905]

Perhaps I’m missing something in this debate, but I don’t recall any of the ‘ pro Glasner ‘ group, of which I am one, has ever claimed that he’s either immune from criticism or that he’s doing everything right.

What I have tried to do is understand the reasons behind this poor start to the season and then present them on here in explanation of why I am still backing the manager rather than arbitrarily sacking him after just 11/12 games.

And yes, it’s a results business. If the team continue to struggle there will come a point when Parish concludes that a change is necessary. And pro Glasner that I am, I would understand, accept and support that decision.

This is pretty much how I feel. Whether some like it or not he has pedigree. He has proved he is a winner. He has been successful everywhere he has coached and its not possible to judge his time here until his time is done.
He needs to be given a fair amount of time. 12 games is simply not fair. Especially under the circumstances we all know he has had to contend with. Palace in my opinion are far more likely to be relegated if we pull the trigger this soon into our season. Especially when performances he been mostly good. Bringing someone else in means ripping up the plan and starting again. And it would likely be another counter attacking firefighter again.
If its still not working in the New year then the owners may decide to roll the dice and bring someone new in. I'd support that IF we are still in the bottom 3. But right now? No way

 

[taylors lovechild]

He took Sunderland down

He didn't just take them down he did it in an embarrassing fashion all the while presenting the face of a slapped fish. Last season only the relegated teams had a worse defensive record than West Ham and despite having an array of attacking talents they frequently looked toothless and dull. It looks like Moyes is off to Leicester anyway, so I don't have to worry about him joining us.

 

[Lanzo-Ad]

He took Sunderland down

Yes, he did, and Steve Coppell took us down twice as did Malcolm Allison

 

[est1905]

Do you think Any of the above teams put there first team out, well they didnt, had a bit more sense than our thicko.

Ok, you really dont know what you are talking about. You seem to be totally blinded by hatred of Glasner. You simply will not acknowledge any of his positive achievements or qualities.

I'll leave it there

 

[Lanzo-Ad]

Ok, you really dont know what you are talking about. You seem to be totally blinded by hatred of Glasner. You simply will not acknowledge any of his positive achievements or qualities.

I'll leave it there

I don't hate Glasner and i didn't hate Vieira, they are just ,IMO, poor managers, lets hope i am wrong and Glasner turns out to be a good manager for us.

 

[silvertop]

This is pretty much how I feel. Whether some like it or not he has pedigree. He has proved he is a winner. He has been successful everywhere he has coached and its not possible to judge his time here until his time is done.
He needs to be given a fair amount of time. 12 games is simply not fair. Especially under the circumstances we all know he has had to contend with. Palace in my opinion are far more likely to be relegated if we pull the trigger this soon into our season. Especially when performances he been mostly good. Bringing someone else in means ripping up the plan and starting again. And it would likely be another counter attacking firefighter again.
If its still not working in the New year then the owners may decide to roll the dice and bring someone new in. I'd support that IF we are still in the bottom 3. But right now? No way

...but always, it seems, with poor runs.

BTW, I am pro Glasner. Give him a full squad (especially a match fit Wharton) and we will be more like the team that finished last season.

 

[Painter]

Yes, he did, and Steve Coppell took us down twice as did Malcolm Allison

Do Coppell and Allison bear any similarity to Moyes in managerial style? Plenty of other managers have taken us down, why pick them?

 

[PatrickA]

Glasner has a very good pedigree and had success with clubs prior to Palace.

However, he has made some bizarre decisions this season which looked strange at the time rather than in hindsight.
Initially he played Lacroix on the right of the back 3 , persisted with Guehi in the centre (the old Anderson role) and used Chaloboah on the left of the back 3 ( where he has never played).
He’s now got round to playing them in their correct positions , but it took a while to get there.

He saw that Kamada can’t play as one of two central midfield players in the West Ham game , but has persisted with using him there on occasions where the tactic has continued to fail.

It’s no coincidence that Sarr had his best game on Saturday when played in his correct position on the right.
Initially Glasner used him on the left or down the middle.
Why?

Against Forest when making substitutions he moved RWB Munoz to the left and put Schlupp at RWB. Bizarre.

I may not have Glasner’s experience or knowledge, but the above seems pretty basic to me.
Play players in their correct positions to at least give them a chance to demonstrate their ability.

 

[MrRobbo]

Glasner has a very good pedigree and had success with clubs prior to Palace.

However, he has made some bizarre decisions this season which looked strange at the time rather than in hindsight.
Initially he played Lacroix on the right of the back 3 , persisted with Guehi in the centre (the old Anderson role) and used Chaloboah on the left of the back 3 ( where he has never played).
He’s now got round to playing them in their correct positions , but it took a while to get there.

He saw that Kamada can’t play as one of two central midfield players in the West Ham game , but has persisted with using him there on occasions where the tactic has continued to fail.

It’s no coincidence that Sarr had his best game on Saturday when played in his correct position on the right.
Initially Glasner used him on the left or down the middle.
Why?

Against Forest when making substitutions he moved RWB Munoz to the left and put Schlupp at RWB. Bizarre.

I may not have Glasner’s experience or knowledge, but the above seems pretty basic to me.
Play players in their correct positions to at least give them a chance to demonstrate their ability.

Just because you don't know the reasons, doesn't mean there weren't very valid ones. .......lets assume OG had reasons for those decision. And he's not just lost the plot.

e.g. Guehi in the centre - not hard to imagine that might have been because he was experienced with the system, and the on-field captain. Having him in the middle would mean he could more easily communicate with the new guys and help talk them through games.

Kamada - He come on for 20 odd mins against WH. He was an attacking sub trying to change the game (which if Eze and OE couuld shoot we would have been 3 nil up). The guy comes with some pedigree. Might want to try to give him a couple of games to settle before deciding that it cant work.

Sarr- I cant remember Sarr playing LW at any point this season....played up front for 20 mins against Chelsea when JMP was out on his arse. Pretty sure every other min he's been on the pitch its been RW.

Forrest - I cant remember that TBF.

 

[PatrickA]

Just because you don't know the reasons, doesn't mean there weren't very valid ones. .......lets assume OG had reasons for those decision. And he's not just lost the plot.

e.g. Guehi in the centre - not hard to imagine that might have been because he was experienced with the system, and the on-field captain. Having him in the middle would mean he could more easily communicate with the new guys and help talk them through games.

Kamada - He come on for 20 odd mins against WH. He was an attacking sub trying to change the game (which if Eze and OE couuld shoot we would have been 3 nil up). The guy comes with some pedigree. Might want to try to give him a couple of games to settle before deciding that it cant work.

Sarr- I cant remember Sarr playing LW at any point this season....played up front for 20 mins against Chelsea when JMP was out on his arse. Pretty sure every other min he's been on the pitch its been RW.

Forrest - I cant remember that TBF.

He has continued to use Kamada in a 2 man central midfield after West Ham, most recently in the Fulham game when he got sent off.
A repeated mistake in other words.
He most recently used Sarr on the left in the Fulham game (Kamada was on the right until moved to midfield in the second half).
I sit in the Main Stand and Sarr was like a fish out of water attacking down my side.
My observations about the Forest game are also valid.
You can say he has reasons, but the key point is that none of these decisions have proved to be successful.

It's not just me who has pointing this out.
There are a number of other posters who spotted the initial failure to deploy the central defenders in their correct positions, the failure of Kamada in a 2 man central midfield and the reluctance to use Sarr in his his most effective position.

None of the above is a reason to sack Glasner.
It's merely to point out that he has some culpability for the team's failures this season.

 

[MrRobbo]

He has continued to use Kamada in a 2 man central midfield after West Ham, most recently in the Fulham game when he got sent off.
A repeated mistake in other words.
He most recently used Sarr on the left in the Fulham game (Kamada was on the right until moved to midfield in the second half).
I sit in the Main Stand and Sarr was like a fish out of water attacking down my side.
My observations about the Forest game are also valid.
You can say he has reasons, but the key point is that none of these decisions have proved to be successful.

It's not just me who has pointing this out.
There are a number of other posters who spotted the initial failure to deploy the central defenders in their correct positions, the failure of Kamada in a 2 man central midfield and the reluctance to use Sarr in his his most effective position.

None of the above is a reason to sack Glasner.
It's merely to point out that he has some culpability for the team's failures this season.

I cant be bothered to keep banging the drum, but this binary view of correct/incorrect is such an oversimplified way of looking at things.

The fact that Glasner is tinkering, shows that he is at least, open to changing things that dont work. But lets also have a bit of trust in the reasons behind the decisions.

e.g. if he played Sarr on the left against Fulham, there must have been a reason, e.g. a tactical plan (exploit a fullback that pushes forward etc) He wont have just done it for a laugh. To say its incorrect is such a binary way of looking at it. I suspect if you asked Glasner he'd offer a more articulate reason, maybe we were on the back foot more that expected so Sarr's starting position was deeper than he wanted, perhaps we had opportunities to release him but the pass wasn't executed, perhaps even if Sarr didnt perform any standout moments he's presence kept Iwobi and Tete from pushing too far forward.

Football is a way more dynamic game, then you are giving it credit for.

 

[NEILLO]

He has continued to use Kamada in a 2 man central midfield after West Ham, most recently in the Fulham game when he got sent off.
A repeated mistake in other words.
He most recently used Sarr on the left in the Fulham game (Kamada was on the right until moved to midfield in the second half).
I sit in the Main Stand and Sarr was like a fish out of water attacking down my side.
My observations about the Forest game are also valid.
You can say he has reasons, but the key point is that none of these decisions have proved to be successful.

It's not just me who has pointing this out.
There are a number of other posters who spotted the initial failure to deploy the central defenders in their correct positions, the failure of Kamada in a 2 man central midfield and the reluctance to use Sarr in his his most effective position.

None of the above is a reason to sack Glasner.
It's merely to point out that he has some culpability for the team's failures this season.

As I wrote earlier, I am pro Glasner , but of course he has some culpability for where we are. If results don’t improve he will pay the ultimate price.

I don’t see any of my fellow pro Glasner posters not recognising his shortcomings, but I do see some on here refusing to recognise his ability.

 

[PatrickA]

I cant be bothered to keep banging the drum, but this binary view of correct/incorrect is such an oversimplified way of looking at things.

The fact that Glasner is tinkering, shows that he is at least, open to changing things that dont work. But lets also have a bit of trust in the reasons behind the decisions.

e.g. if he played Sarr on the left against Fulham, there must have been a reason, e.g. a tactical plan (exploit a fullback that pushes forward etc) He wont have just done it for a laugh. To say its incorrect is such a binary way of looking at it. I suspect if you asked Glasner he'd offer a more articulate reason, maybe we were on the back foot more that expected so Sarr's starting position was deeper than he wanted, perhaps we had opportunities to release him but the pass wasn't executed, perhaps even if Sarr didnt perform any standout moments he's presence kept Iwobi and Tete from pushing too far forward.

Football is a way more dynamic game, then you are giving it credit for.

We'll have to agree to disagree.
The decisions haven't worked,and for you that's fine as 'he had his reasons,' for his choices.
By way of balance, I was concerned when he first played Clyne on the right of the back 3 last season and yet it worked brilliantly.
When the decisions/ choices don't work it seems odd to persist with them though.