War in Ukraine

[Stirlingsays]

And you clearly know what this deranged Putin would do. After all he is a mad dictator 🤷🏻‍♂️

If he is loosing face or power why wouldn't he fire a few nuclear as last resort?

The Germans developed the chemical weapons but did not have a chance to use them. They were also developing nuclear weapons to use them. There was a race to make one.

? I have no idea how you came to that conclusion.

Hitler called the idea of nuclear bombs 'Jewish science' I believe and switched development to rocket technology. They weren't racing compared to the Americans.

 

[eaglesdare]

? I have no idea how you came to that conclusion.

Hitler called the idea of nuclear bombs 'Jewish science' I believe and switched development to rocket technology. They weren't racing compared to the Americans.

I guess where I go with that logic is that they developed and stockpiled them but did not have the means to deploy them properly.

I could be wrong tho and I am always interested in learning something new about the WW2. I do find it interesting.

 

[Spindle]

Russian missile tech is very good and their aircraft grouping has had three years of a real war to learn. Their artillery....which is always the biggest killer on the battlefield outnumber Ukraine at least three to one.

While I obviously don't support getting involved at all and regard Trump ending this war as the most sensible pathway....probably sometime in the summer.....If we do get involved with Russia we....and by we I mean Europe need at least three years of military build up....We don't have the ammo supplies for a start nor any nationalistic ideology in our youth.

Old men don't win wars....but they usually end up starting them.

The R27 fired at Rivitjoint fell off the pylon and dropped into the sea. I can't believe how much of a malfunction that is given that the pilot would've had to put a lock onto Rivitjoint in order to fire it. When that lock came I can't imagine the concern from crew, because that lock would've lit up the sensor. Incredible lack of discipline.

As for outnumbering arty, Russia has wild accuracy, they can only carpet shell an area taking many more shells for the same job. A single Excalibur round though, that's hitting the target on the bonce, from far further back too. NATO has radar calculated response systems for shelling, tracing shells to the source and immediately firing onto that source. They won't be able to fire those shells without a gun.

 

[Stirlingsays]

I guess where I go with that logic is that they developed and stockpiled them but did not have the means to deploy them properly.

I could be wrong tho and I am always interested in learning something new about the WW2. I do find it interesting.

Sorry mate, my post came off as a little rude.

I got distracted in this madhouse that is currently called home.

 

[Spindle]

Russia isn't filled with social liberals, indeed Putin is a moderate compared to most in the Kremlin.

I grew up in the first cold war and I really don't like this attitude.....at least the politicians of that period took the risks seriously.

The problem with saying it isn't going to happen is that you don't get any consequences for being wrong do you.....because we are all fecking dead.

It could even happen as a sodding accident, in fact this nearly did happen.....Having nukes pointed at each other is something that needs to end asap.

I have Russia's cheap energy bringing down our bills....I don't want its nukes.

I'm anti nuke. A waste of money, and yeah it nearly happened by accident and deliberately, but never did. Putin doesn't actually press the button

 

[Stirlingsays]

The R27 fired at Rivitjoint fell off the pylon and dropped into the sea. I can't believe how much of a malfunction that is given that the pilot would've had to put a lock onto Rivitjoint in order to fire it. When that lock came I can't imagine the concern from crew, because that lock would've lit up the sensor. Incredible lack of discipline.

As for outnumbering arty, Russia has wild accuracy, they can only carpet shell an area taking many more shells for the same job. A single Excalibur round though, that's hitting the target on the bonce, from far further back too. NATO has radar calculated response systems for shelling, tracing shells to the source and immediately firing onto that source. They won't be able to fire those shells without a gun.

Nato is something like 90 percent America.

You are kind of talking up something that has no support......You can argue about the effectiveness of individual systems but Russia would just overwhelm you with scale.....As Ukraine/Nato has already found out.

 

[eaglesdare]

Yeah, so he did have the means to produce complex chemicals which contradicts your assertion. But naked starved Jews in a large room weren't going to launch chemicals back at his troops.

In case you had not realized I was trolling you for a little bit. Sorry 😝

Of course I don't think Putin is a madman or like Hitler. And I don't think he would use nuclear weapons. But he might. You never know until it's too late.

Scrolling back a few posts. I do hope that war does not escalate as we would all be jeopardy then
I do think it looks to be a never ending war, debt and death at this point if the UK and EU keep stumping up money. So what's the point anymore in going over the same old same old when it won't end.

Also looks like two tier kier agrees with Trump:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1896131906283978864

 

[eaglesdare]

Sorry mate, my post came off as a little rude.

I got distracted in this madhouse that is currently called home.

No worries ☺️ it happens I'm sure some of my posts in past have done the same. 😅

 

[ASCPFC]

The R27 fired at Rivitjoint fell off the pylon and dropped into the sea. I can't believe how much of a malfunction that is given that the pilot would've had to put a lock onto Rivitjoint in order to fire it. When that lock came I can't imagine the concern from crew, because that lock would've lit up the sensor. Incredible lack of discipline.

As for outnumbering arty, Russia has wild accuracy, they can only carpet shell an area taking many more shells for the same job. A single Excalibur round though, that's hitting the target on the bonce, from far further back too. NATO has radar calculated response systems for shelling, tracing shells to the source and immediately firing onto that source. They won't be able to fire those shells without a gun.

I can genuinely tell you that even the most advanced weaponry has perhaps 40% accuracy - usually taking a zone of maybe 20-100m from a target. Look at Gaza - and you can see how the targeting of some of the most advanced missiles works. Sometimes it's genuinely better to just fire normal artillery - particularly in poor conditions. The Russians are pretty decent at that. Where Russia fails is co-ordination - particularly of the air force. It barely has a functioning navy, and it has very poor morale and discipline in most of its forces. Add in a load of corruption on procurement, pay and equipment and it is what it is.

 

[Stirlingsays]

I'm anti nuke. A waste of money, and yeah it nearly happened by accident and deliberately, but never did. Putin doesn't actually press the button

Once again, I don't like this attitude.....You only have to be wrong once and I don't get to fecking kill the people who would be fecking killing my kids do I?

So if it's all the very same to you I don't give a damn who runs the donbas......I didn't even care that much who ran East Germany......I mean I'm glad the Soviet Union fell but now I'm meant to care which slav runs Ukraine?

Frigging nuts.

 

[Spindle]

Nato is something like 90 percent America.

You are kind of talking up something that has no support......You can argue about the effectiveness of individual systems but Russia would just overwhelm you with scale.....As Ukraine/Nato has already found out.

I think you overestimate Russia's economic power and military power. Their industrial production is poor, they are buying back from abroad. Ukraine decimated their main force using old kit with a hand behind their back. Where are the wonder tank T90 Armada's? Where's the Felon (all four of them).

The USA could beat Russia in conventional war in a fortnight, the EU could definitely beat Russia out of Ukraine.

USA has volume but not all the best kit alone. Plenty of power in the EU military.
F35, Typhoon, Gripon, Rafael with Aim120D, Meteor are going to force the Russians way back. Brimstone, Stormshadow, Maverick Paveway and an array of other weapons, Apache E, would achieve dominance in the sky and battlefield, EU armour is not American, MLRS systems, starstreak, the variety of Sam and arty systems are not American.

It's a bill, and if we can't afford it then why make the stuff? Just beg Russia and hope for the best.

I'm not advocating it, just disagree that we'd get beat easily by this paper bear.

 

[Spindle]

I guess where I go with that logic is that they developed and stockpiled them but did not have the means to deploy them properly.

I could be wrong tho and I am always interested in learning something new about the WW2. I do find it interesting.

My hobby, although I'm really more up on the western air war, a hell of a lot in fact, although know "quite a lot more than most" about the ETO and PTO air wars.

 

[Stirlingsays]

I think you overestimate Russia's economic power and military power.

That's literally the mistake that was made three years ago.

The whole reason we are in this mess and now on the hock for a King's ransom if Ukraine can't pay back its debts.

I've heard it all, from Russia switching out transistors from washing machines to their men fighting with shovels.....None of it seems to actually relate to actual battlefield reports and who's advancing.

I thought it was b0llocks at the time and I can't say anything I've seen since has shown me otherwise.

 

[Spindle]

Once again, I don't like this attitude.....You only have to be wrong once and I don't get to fecking kill the people who would be fecking killing my kids do I?

So if it's all the very same to you I don't give a damn who runs the donbas......I didn't even care that much who ran East Germany......I mean I'm glad the Soviet Union fell but now I'm meant to care which slav runs Ukraine?

Frigging nuts.

All Trump needs to do is put in security guarantees....

 

[Stirlingsays]

All Trump needs to do is put in security guarantees....

He trusts Ukraine less than he trusts Russia.....considering Ukraine's only hope of getting their land back is to involve the US militarily I can understand why he thinks that.

I can't say I believe Trump will provide any cast iron security guarantees.....but you never know....but I don't see it. That's gonna be mugs like us and France.

You know, ever since some eastern European countries were given the Nato umbellar I hear their politicians piping up on Twitter talking tough against Russia......I suspect Trump hears that too and doesn't want any part of bit part players talking tough whilst hiding behind big brother.

 

[Spindle]

I can genuinely tell you that even the most advanced weaponry has perhaps 40% accuracy - usually taking a zone of maybe 20-100m from a target. Look at Gaza - and you can see how the targeting of some of the most advanced missiles works. Sometimes it's genuinely better to just fire normal artillery - particularly in poor conditions. The Russians are pretty decent at that. Where Russia fails is co-ordination - particularly of the air force. It barely has a functioning navy, and it has very poor morale and discipline in most of its forces. Add in a load of corruption on procurement, pay and equipment and it is what it is.

Depends on what you are talking about. BVR is a game and there are lots of factors to defeat a missile. An IR sidewinder X though, you're dead. Starstreak has a 99% hit rate for example too, again a different mechanism.

As for Gaza, target value matters. A mk82 dumb bomb can be delivered inaccurately, roughly using CCIP systems (a complex bombsight) and yes, inaccurate, but only $4000 each, Put a Boeing guidance kit on it then it's $50000 and it'll land exactly where your targeting pod is telling it to. A lot of places in Gaza, to the IDF, weren't worth the guidance kit.

 

[eaglesdare]

He trusts Ukraine less than he trusts Russia.....considering Ukraine's only hope of getting their land back is to involve the US militarily I can understand why he thinks that.

I can't say I believe Trump will provide any cast iron security guarantees.....but you never know....but I don't see it. That's gonna be mugs like us and France.

You know, ever since some eastern European countries were given the Nato umbellar I hear their politicians piping up on Twitter talking tough against Russia......I suspect Trump hears that too and doesn't want any part of bit part players talking tough whilst hiding behind big brother.

The thing is I believe the minerals deal is the security guarantee. Putin is not going start bombing or invade US assets. It would put an end to the war.

Just my opinion anyway.

 

[Stirlingsays]

The thing is I believe the minerals deal is the security guarantee. Putin is not going start bombing or invade US assets. It would put an end to the war.

Just my opinion anyway.

After that show in the White House and Europeans essentially going ape on online is that deal even likely now? Musk, who is getting all this feedback, literally said this morning said that the US should leave Nato and the UN....Trump listens to him.

I mean Trump could just as easily sign a mineral deal with Russia.

Europe is a socially liberal domain who just hate Trump and while I regard Starmer as having done well diplomatically I think he's been backed up extremely poorly by the European political class.

 

[eaglesdare]

After that show in the White House and Europeans essentially going ape on online is that deal even likely now? Musk, who is getting all this feedback, literally said this morning said that the US should leave Nato and the UN....Trump listens to him.

I mean Trump could just as easily sign a mineral deal with Russia.

Europe is a socially liberal domain who just hate Trump and while I regard Starmer as having done well diplomatically I think he's been backed up extremely poorly by the European political class.

That's true I agree with you. I can't see it being signed now.
Perhaps I should have said the minerals deal 'was' the security deal.

 

[DANGERCLOSE]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1896026564019830820