Parish Out

[PatrickA]

Starmeresque delusion

Well I suppose he is a marketing man at heart ....' now with new improved etc...'

 

[Eaglecoops]

I want to try and put some perspective on all this hate towards Parish and the board by some of the supporter base. Before this period of success in the Premier League we had never managed to stay in the Premier league for more than one season before being relegated.
We were in the old 1st division when the Prem started and unfortunately we were relegated in the first season of the Prem league and then embarked on a series of promotions (3) and relegations until we finally got promoted in 2013, and have been there ever since.
However when you look at the number of years we have spent in the top flight it amounts to a total of 25 seasons, so considering we have been in the top flight now for 13 seasons it doesn’t take a mathematician to work out that since 1905 we have only ever been in the top league for 12 previous seasons.

We have traditionally been a 2nd tier team and have spent a total of 37 years in the second division and a further 47 years in between the 3rd tier down to non league. Albeit these were the early formative years.

Then when you take into account our record in the fa cup, we have got to the final on 2 previous occasions and lost both games to ManU and the variously named league cup we have never got beyond the semifinals.

Beyond the football we have been in administration on 2 separate occasions, and the last period in 2010 we were very close to no longer having a club to support.

I don’t disagree that we all would have expected the board to strengthen the squad in the summer, and yes we did spend £80m but didn’t get much value for our money this time. This is why the transfer market is so difficult to navigate, furthermore none of us have all the info on who we tried to get and who turned us down.

So on reflection we are actually doing quite well. Yes we would all love to break into the top 6 every year, and win a cup every few years but the reality is this is never going to happen. The game is rigged to prevent clubs outside of the top 6 from penetrating their monopoly.

So if you are still reading this long winded post, all I ask is that we all give the board some slack and trust/hope that they turn this current malaise around. Then if we do what we are good at and get behind the team we can hopefully all get back on the same page.

COYP

Don’t forget that a large number of new Palace fans have known nothing except Palace in the PL, they don’t have the scars that we carry.

 

[Team of the (20)80s]

I want to try and put some perspective on all this hate towards Parish and the board by some of the supporter base. Before this period of success in the Premier League we had never managed to stay in the Premier league for more than one season before being relegated.
We were in the old 1st division when the Prem started and unfortunately we were relegated in the first season of the Prem league and then embarked on a series of promotions (3) and relegations until we finally got promoted in 2013, and have been there ever since.
However when you look at the number of years we have spent in the top flight it amounts to a total of 25 seasons, so considering we have been in the top flight now for 13 seasons it doesn’t take a mathematician to work out that since 1905 we have only ever been in the top league for 12 previous seasons.

We have traditionally been a 2nd tier team and have spent a total of 37 years in the second division and a further 47 years in between the 3rd tier down to non league. Albeit these were the early formative years.

Then when you take into account our record in the fa cup, we have got to the final on 2 previous occasions and lost both games to ManU and the variously named league cup we have never got beyond the semifinals.

Beyond the football we have been in administration on 2 separate occasions, and the last period in 2010 we were very close to no longer having a club to support.

I don’t disagree that we all would have expected the board to strengthen the squad in the summer, and yes we did spend £80m but didn’t get much value for our money this time. This is why the transfer market is so difficult to navigate, furthermore none of us have all the info on who we tried to get and who turned us down.

So on reflection we are actually doing quite well. Yes we would all love to break into the top 6 every year, and win a cup every few years but the reality is this is never going to happen. The game is rigged to prevent clubs outside of the top 6 from penetrating their monopoly.

So if you are still reading this long winded post, all I ask is that we all give the board some slack and trust/hope that they turn this current malaise around. Then if we do what we are good at and get behind the team we can hopefully all get back on the same page.

COYP

This is exactly my thoughts, but put better and more thoroughly than I could ever be arsed to do.

 

[PatrickA]

I've been a supporter of the club for nigh on 60 years.
I've seen them all from Bloye, Noades, Goldberg, Jordan through Parish.
Make no mistake, Parish has been great from.the club.
However, this does not make him immune from constructive criticism (as opposed to hatred) and he himself has acknowledged that he has made mistakes- who doesn't make them?
What I don't understand is the repeated difficulties every transfer window which seem to present a real difficulty for the club every time.
Last minute (dis)organised chaos would seem an apt description.
Glasner is not the first manager to have struggled with this under Parish.

 

[Paul Salvage]

Don’t forget that a large number of new Palace fans have known nothing except Palace in the PL, they don’t have the scars that we carry.

I understand that, and that is why I wanted to give a brief history to our great club. My son is 22 and his first season ticket year was our promotion year in 2013. He has had a season ticket ever since then and only knows the good times. He has had 13 years in the premier league and 3 fa cup semis and 2 finals. He thinks this is the norm!
So I do understand why some fans expect more, and hopefully they will also now see the other side of the coin. It is not about being a Parish disciple it’s about understanding who we are, and what we are. I am just getting a bit frustrated with the same conversations and same arguments all the time with no real understanding why we have the points of view that we do.
With regard to my own son I try to keep him grounded and say it won’t last, but what does this old fart know?

 

[Paul Salvage]

This is exactly my thoughts, but put better and more thoroughly than I could ever be arsed to do.

I did post this as a new topic (History Lesson) as I didn’t want the sentiment to be lost in the sea of Parish out posts, but the mods decided to merge it.

 

[Lanzo-Ad]

I want to try and put some perspective on all this hate towards Parish and the board by some of the supporter base. Before this period of success in the Premier League we had never managed to stay in the Premier league for more than one season before being relegated.
We were in the old 1st division when the Prem started and unfortunately we were relegated in the first season of the Prem league and then embarked on a series of promotions (3) and relegations until we finally got promoted in 2013, and have been there ever since.
However when you look at the number of years we have spent in the top flight it amounts to a total of 25 seasons, so considering we have been in the top flight now for 13 seasons it doesn’t take a mathematician to work out that since 1905 we have only ever been in the top league for 12 previous seasons.

We have traditionally been a 2nd tier team and have spent a total of 37 years in the second division and a further 47 years in between the 3rd tier down to non league. Albeit these were the early formative years.

Then when you take into account our record in the fa cup, we have got to the final on 2 previous occasions and lost both games to ManU and the variously named league cup we have never got beyond the semifinals.

Beyond the football we have been in administration on 2 separate occasions, and the last period in 2010 we were very close to no longer having a club to support.

I don’t disagree that we all would have expected the board to strengthen the squad in the summer, and yes we did spend £80m but didn’t get much value for our money this time. This is why the transfer market is so difficult to navigate, furthermore none of us have all the info on who we tried to get and who turned us down.

So on reflection we are actually doing quite well. Yes we would all love to break into the top 6 every year, and win a cup every few years but the reality is this is never going to happen. The game is rigged to prevent clubs outside of the top 6 from penetrating their monopoly.

So if you are still reading this long winded post, all I ask is that we all give the board some slack and trust/hope that they turn this current malaise around. Then if we do what we are good at and get behind the team we can hopefully all get back on the same page.

COYP

A superbly written post, 100% agree with all of it, Parish is the only Palace man on the board, and long may he stay.

 

[waterfordpal]

I don’t see how we can blame Parish for this window. Firstly he got in Johnson early. Secondly what’s all this bull about a Guehi replacement ? We already have Riad and Canvot . Thirdly it’s not his fault the Mateta/ Strand Larson deal is dragging on as the club have set a price on Mateta and its other clubs dragging their heels trying to squeeze the fee. And if we don’t ‘replace’ him no harm as he hasn’t being scoring for us anyway so he won’t be missed. Parish ain’t perfect but if he gets €35m and hangs on to it for the next manager I won’t complain as Sarr, Johnson and Uiche will get us clear.

 

[Paul Salvage]

I've been a supporter of the club for nigh on 60 years.
I've seen them all from Bloye, Noades, Goldberg, Jordan through Parish.
Make no mistake, Parish has been great from.the club.
However, this does not make him immune from constructive criticism (as opposed to hatred) and he himself has acknowledged that he has made mistakes- who doesn't make them?
What I don't understand is the repeated difficulties every transfer window which seem to present a real difficulty for the club every time.
Last minute (dis)organised chaos would seem an apt description.
Glasner is not the first manager to have struggled with this under Parish.

I honestly think the transfer market has just become so complicated. Everybody wants their slice of the pie. I expect we identify a player we want and make contact with the club, but as soon as the agent gets involved the player is being touted here, there and every where.

At this current time Palace is not a destination club, it’s is a stepping stone. This is why we have success with buying young players as they know (before OG) that they get a chance to prove themselves and hope to move on. But more seasoned players that would be first team ready don’t see us as a viable option. I don’t know why that is, but would have hoped the fa cup win would have improved our profile.
I believe it is reputed that a club need to spend in excess of 100m every year just to stand still.

 

[Paul Salvage]

A superbly written post, 100% agree with all of it, Parish is the only Palace man on the board, and long may he stay.

Thank you.
In all honesty the post is not meant to be about Parish per se. I was just trying to explain why we are not in as bad a place as some think.
However I do trust Parish to do the right thing, despite his mistakes, and I also expect that he will step away at some point (probably when the stand is built) and leave us in a better place than when he took over.
Palaces progress is like watching a glacier move (or JP) but we are making progress.

 

[PatrickA]

I honestly think the transfer market has just become so complicated. Everybody wants their slice of the pie. I expect we identify a player we want and make contact with the club, but as soon as the agent gets involved the player is being touted here, there and every where.

At this current time Palace is not a destination club, it’s is a stepping stone. This is why we have success with buying young players as they know (before OG) that they get a chance to prove themselves and hope to move on. But more seasoned players that would be first team ready don’t see us as a viable option. I don’t know why that is, but would have hoped the fa cup win would have improved our profile.
I believe it is reputed that a club need to spend in excess of 100m every year just to stand still.

I'm not trying to be difficult but comparable clubs to us like Bournemouth, Brighton and Brentford rarely have these problems.
They don't tend to have this last minute nonsense every window.
The first you know of their signings by and large is when they're wearing the shirt.
If it was one window at Palace fair enough, but it's nearly every window.

If the strategy is to wait untl the last minute for the best deal why pay £35 million for Johnson in the first week of the window when, as far as I'm aware there was no competition fir his services.
If the argument is that it was to cover the few games that Sarr was absent at Afcon, that's an expensive piece of cover.

 

[Paul Salvage]

I'm not trying to be difficult but comparable clubs to us like Bournemouth, Brighton and Brentford rarely have these problems.
They don't tend to have this last minute nonsense every window.
The first you know of their signings by and large is when they're wearing the shirt.
If it was one window at Palace fair enough, but it's nearly every window.

If the strategy is to wait untl the last minute for the best deal why pay £35 million for Johnson in the first week of the window when, as far as I'm aware there was no competition fir his services.
If the argument is that it was to cover the few games that Sarr was absent at Afcon, that's an expensive piece of cover.

I honestly can’t explain it. The only conclusion I have is that the clubs you mention are known selling clubs and all with incredible track records in selling for big fees. (Players get a percentage of the fee or a signing on percentage I guess)
We clearly have a club strategy to leave it late, as it is repeated time and time again. All I do know is that whenever we pay big money for a player, it rarely works out!
Personally I would break the bank and try to recruit either the Weed or Brentford scouting team.

 

[Steval]

It’s a combination of both.

The Premier League didn’t force Parish to endorse the sale of Guehi twice without having what most of us consider to be a replacement.

Nor did it make him preside over the sale of Mateta , the on off purchase of Strand Larsen and the loan signing of a player that chose to go elsewhere last summer.

Add to that the confusing situation with Glasner and it looks like a mess which is borne out by recent results.

Yes, I’m disillusioned with Premier League football and of course that’s not all on him. And yes, agreed that he can’t control everything.

But the bits that he could influence I think he’s come up short.

There’s nothing wrong with finishing in mid table in the Premier League for a club of our size - plenty others would love to be in that position.

But I’m past being grateful for it. He’s the best man for the job if the objective is just to stay in the Premier League. And increasingly that’s about as much as can be hoped for.

So it’s not a competition in the true sense of the word.

I’d no doubt feel differently if the farcical events of this season hadn’t taken place. But they have

 

[Ex Dubai Eagle]

I honestly can’t explain it. The only conclusion I have is that the clubs you mention are known selling clubs and all with incredible track records in selling for big fees. (Players get a percentage of the fee or a signing on percentage I guess)
We clearly have a club strategy to leave it late, as it is repeated time and time again. All I do know is that whenever we pay big money for a player, it rarely works out!
Personally I would break the bank and try to recruit either the Weed or Brentford scouting team.

One of the challenges of following a club closely is that all of the mistakes are magnified, I certainly don't know very much about the clubs you mention except they seem (at least from a distance) to have a good recruitment structure & seem to be successful at it, I bet if you found a knowledgeable fan of each of those clubs they would probably be able to tell you some transfer stories that compare to ours.

 

[Painter]

I've been a supporter of the club for nigh on 60 years.
I've seen them all from Bloye, Noades, Goldberg, Jordan through Parish.
Make no mistake, Parish has been great from.the club.
However, this does not make him immune from constructive criticism (as opposed to hatred) and he himself has acknowledged that he has made mistakes- who doesn't make them?
What I don't understand is the repeated difficulties every transfer window which seem to present a real difficulty for the club every time.
Last minute (dis)organised chaos would seem an apt description.
Glasner is not the first manager to have struggled with this under Parish.

The difficulty in the transfer market is the expectation of prices for average players from other clubs. During Parish's tenure, Palace have done particularly well in the transfer market, picking up Eze, Guehi, Olise and Wharton cheaply. Unless you are a big club with money no object and players keen to sign for them or you take the drunken sailor approach of Goldberg, you have a budget and stick to it and not get ripped off.

 

[Midlands Eagle]

what’s all this bull about a Guehi replacement ? We already have Riad and Canvot .

You want to replace one of the best defenders in England and a shoe in for the England team with someone who has been out injured for a year and is still an unknown quantity or else a youngster whose mistakes have already cost us points

 

[PatrickA]

The difficulty in the transfer market is the expectation of prices for average players from other clubs. During Parish's tenure, Palace have done particularly well in the transfer market, picking up Eze, Guehi, Olise and Wharton cheaply. Unless you are a big club with money no object and players keen to sign for them or you take the drunken sailor approach of Goldberg, you have a budget and stick to it and not get ripped off.

I disagree.
Brentford, Brighton and Bournemouth show it can be done, plan well ahead and don't have these last minute transfer window dramas.
Bournemouth's latest is Kroupi who cost an initial £10 million and looks a bargain.

In terms of planning Parish made it clear that we wouldn't letting Guehi go for free meaning he was always going to go this window.
Any sign of a quality replacement more than 2 weeks after Guehi's departure?
It cost us against Sunderland and Chelsea and may well cost us again today.
Apparently we're casting around for a not wanted last minute Chelsea loan centre back tomorrow.
We're two down on centre backs from this time last year when we had Chaloboah and Guehi too.
Nobody can say with a straight face that our transfer planning looks coherent.

 

[Paul Salvage]

You want to replace one of the best defenders in England and a shoe in for the England team with someone who has been out injured for a year and is still an unknown quantity or else a youngster whose mistakes have already cost us points

So how do you get a replacement for Marc? It’s the same for Olise and for Eze. We will never be able to replace them like for like because they are at a level that in truth is too good for Palace. This is why they go for good money.
I guess the hope in Marc’s case is that Riad finally recovers sufficiently to be a member of the team and that Canvot grows into a good player. If I recall Marc wasn’t the finished article when he signed for us, but was given a chance.
The other issue is that a new manager may play a different system and only require 2 centre backs, then we have cover.

 

[Paul Salvage]

I disagree.
Brentford, Brighton and Bournemouth show it can be done, plan well ahead and don't have these last minute transfer window dramas.
Bournemouth's latest is Kroupi who cost an initial £10 million and looks a bargain.

In terms of planning Parish made it clear that we wouldn't letting Guehi go for free meaning he was always going to go this window.
Any sign of a quality replacement more than 2 weeks after Guehi's departure?
It cost us against Sunderland and Chelsea and may well cost us again today.
Apparently we're casting around for a not wanted last minute Chelsea loan centre back tomorrow.
We're two down on centre backs from this time last year when we had Chaloboah and Guehi too.
Nobody can say with a straight face that our transfer planning looks coherent.

I don’t think any fan would disagree with that. Our transfer dealings are definitely the weakest point in the clubs armoury. The loss of Freedman has definitely not helped. Is it a case of us not scouting properly, or maybe we believe that the academy will come good.
I do wonder if you spoke to fans from the clubs you mention if they think they get it right all the time. I suspect that they also buy duds but largely go under the radar. It is only ever the the players that do well that look great value.

 

[NEILLO]

So how do you get a replacement for Marc? It’s the same for Olise and for Eze. We will never be able to replace them like for like because they are at a level that in truth is too good for Palace. This is why they go for good money.
I guess the hope in Marc’s case is that Riad finally recovers sufficiently to be a member of the team and that Canvot grows into a good player. If I recall Marc wasn’t the finished article when he signed for us, but was given a chance.
The other issue is that a new manager may play a different system and only require 2 centre backs, then we have cover.

I think the point here from my perspective is that we obviously can't get a like for like replacement. But what we could get is an experienced player in even if on loan.

Relying on the likes of Canvot and Riad doesn't seem prudent to me. Given that there is now a real need to get some points on the board, this doesn't feel the right time for a player still learning the game and an injury prone player whose quality is unproven, to be thrown in. Yes we have the experienced Lerma, but he is also needed to provide cover in midfield.

Planning for any new managers possible tactical approach isn't for now.