Kamada

[OneStevePerrin]

You're wrong.

Hughes picked up no yellow card today. He picks them up strategically to thwart potentially dangerous situations, as commented on by himself and previous managers. It's appreciated by people who know what they're talking about.

He's not in the team for his creativity. He's in the team for his defensive attributes and his leadership, of which are enormous and invaluable.

The best we've looked for the past decade was that patch in 2024 when Wharton and Hughes were the beating heart of our midfield. We dominated everyone.

I’m not writing Hughes of yet, but recent cameo appearances and starting yesterday haven’t been so good. Thought he looked poor yesterday and Lerma looked much better with Wharton when he came on. As for Kamada he was in the No 10 position and was also instrumental in us winning.

 

[PatrickA]

Hughes is at his best when he has a run of games and gets into his rhythm.
Stops and starts and bit part roles don't do him any favours.
Nonetheless, he never lets the team down.

Kamada is a different type of player and offers a different skillset which brings a lot to the team.

 

[sprites]

I’m not writing Hughes of yet, but recent cameo appearances and starting yesterday haven’t been so good. Thought he looked poor yesterday and Lerma looked much better with Wharton when he came on. As for Kamada he was in the No 10 position and was also instrumental in us winning.

Instrumental? Today? Mateta and (to a lesser extend) Sarr made the difference.

 

[MrRobbo]

IMO the team doesn't function with a midfield of Hughes and Lerma. That first half yesterday was devoid of any midfield control. I dont dislike either of them, but they are limited in terms of what they can add to the team. They are bottom half scrappers. We have to aspire to more technically competent players.

Yesterday, we looked significantly more fluid when Kamada came on. And a decent feint and pass out wide was key in the opening goal.

The haters will reject any sort of subjective comments, like we looked more fluid when he came on, or that he's been a mainstay in the most successful period of the clubs history.

But they will also reject facts, that point to Kamada making more tackles than Hughes and Lerma, and making more progressive passes and carries.

They dont see the value he adds, but also aren't humble enough to realise that maybe Glasner knows what he's doing. Or that he's inclusion crosses over with the best period in our club's history.

But these are also the same people that said Canvot was cr@p and selling Guehi was suicide, and are also hating on Pino.

Unfortuently some are never happier then when they are being negative.

 

[Willo]

IMO the team doesn't function with a midfield of Hughes and Lerma. That first half yesterday was devoid of any midfield control. I dont dislike either of them, but they are limited in terms of what they can add to the team. They are bottom half scrappers. We have to aspire to more technically competent players.

Yesterday, we looked significantly more fluid when Kamada came on. And a decent feint and pass out wide was key in the opening goal.

The haters will reject any sort of subjective comments, like we looked more fluid when he came on, or that he's been a mainstay in the most successful period of the clubs history.

But they will also reject facts, that point to Kamada making more tackles than Hughes and Lerma, and making more progressive passes and carries.

They dont see the value he adds, but also aren't humble enough to realise that maybe Glasner knows what he's doing. Or that he's inclusion crosses over with the best period in our club's history.

But these are also the same people that said Canvot was cr@p and selling Guehi was suicide, and are also hating on Pino.

Unfortuently some are never happier then when they are being negative.

I am in agreement with this viewpoint, indeed this thought process entered my mind yesterday at the game.I have actually formed this conclusion way before the Newcastle game.
Apropos Kamada, I appreciate his worth to the team and my opinion of his contributions differ from those who view him in a negative light.

 

[Teddy Eagle]

Have we ever had a player who's divided opinion as much as Kamada? Jordan Ayew had his detractors but he didn't attract the same level of vitriol.

 

[NEILLO]

IMO the team doesn't function with a midfield of Hughes and Lerma. That first half yesterday was devoid of any midfield control. I dont dislike either of them, but they are limited in terms of what they can add to the team. They are bottom half scrappers. We have to aspire to more technically competent players.

Yesterday, we looked significantly more fluid when Kamada came on. And a decent feint and pass out wide was key in the opening goal.

The haters will reject any sort of subjective comments, like we looked more fluid when he came on, or that he's been a mainstay in the most successful period of the clubs history.

But they will also reject facts, that point to Kamada making more tackles than Hughes and Lerma, and making more progressive passes and carries.

They dont see the value he adds, but also aren't humble enough to realise that maybe Glasner knows what he's doing. Or that he's inclusion crosses over with the best period in our club's history.

But these are also the same people that said Canvot was cr@p and selling Guehi was suicide, and are also hating on Pino.

Unfortuently some are never happier then when they are being negative.

Kamada certainly divides opinion on here.

When he puts in a performance his value to the team is evident. My issue with him is that he doesn't do it consistently.

I certainly trust Glasner's judgement over my own whether I agree with him or not, although most of the time I do.

As regards Canvot and Pino, Canvot is clearly a work in progress. Now he's having a run in the team he's finding his rhythm and I think he has the potential to keep his place in the starting line up going forward into next season. Pino has obvious qualities but has found the going tough in the Premier League. But he never ' hides ' and there's much more to come from him I'm sure.

The problem both of those players have had was at a time when they should be being nurtured they have found themselves in the thick of the mid season disruption that we had.

I didn't think selling Guehi was '' suicide '' but the timing of his departure(s) didn't do us any favours. However, I've no interest in rehashing that debate !

 

[CPFCSaturn]

Have we ever had a player who's divided opinion as much as Kamada? Jordan Ayew had his detractors but he didn't attract the same level of vitriol.

So much of it is just people not wanting to admit they were wrong after labelling him s*** when he first joined (he was honking for the first few months).

It's beyond belief people are still suggesting Hughes over him.

 

[CPFCSaturn]

You're wrong.

Hughes picked up no yellow card today. He picks them up strategically to thwart potentially dangerous situations, as commented on by himself and previous managers. It's appreciated by people who know what they're talking about.

He's not in the team for his creativity. He's in the team for his defensive attributes and his leadership, of which are enormous and invaluable.

The best we've looked for the past decade was that patch in 2024 when Wharton and Hughes were the beating heart of our midfield. We dominated everyone.

Sometimes.

He also picks up a huge amount of them diving into stupid tackles that he doesn't need to make.

 

[CPFCSaturn]

Personally I wasn't basing my assessment on his stats, just on what I see when he plays.

I'm not sure we are a better side when he plays. He's certainly played in a good few stinkers. I don't blame him for the teams poor run or all those terrible slogs in Europe, but he definitely looked like part of the problem to me.

That's good, because he was injured for a massive chunk of it!

He got injured against City on 14th December after which we went on an 11-game winless run.

He was back in the squad for Brighton on 8th Feb, and results have been much improved since then.

Obviously Kamada is not solely responsible for that, but he is certainly a big factor.

 

[palace99]

Glasner ? isn't there a clause in every manager's contract ? something prohibiting them leaving a club and taking all their favourite players with them ? you often see a manager leave and then a contractual time-lag ( 6 to 18 months) before their players follow them.


Kamada has always been involved in our greatest games. Love him or hate him, the statistics do not lie. Whether or not he was also complicit in our notorious dip in Form ? i will leave that for some other Eagle to investigate. But a good performing Kamada is defo World-Class.

The answer is no, however, if a club approach another club to speak to their manager along with compensation the clubs can agree specific arrangements i.e. not to buy players for say 12 months etc.
I would say this is the exception not the rule.

As for Glasner he will not have a club after 30/6 so can speak to whoever he wants and via that club can bid for whatever players he wants.

As for Kamada i think both sides saw it as a 2 year deal (does he speak English?) and he was not going to stay longer.

In terms of his salary i don't think he has been a disaster (especially when compared to say Nketiah and Johnson who both also had big transfer fees), but could have proved better value for money.

I suspect the full cost for him is nearer £15m as there will be agents fees and say FA club bonuses not included in the initial weekly wage (although i suspect other bonuses are - rule of thump is c90% wages are fixed, with 10% in bonuses - can be higher for younger, and/or injury prone players) .
If he was on say £50k a week i suspect the total cost who would nearer £7m to the club, so £8m sunk costs over 2 years.

As a No10 he has shown his limitations and his lack of a left foot has not helped.

As a No 6 he has adjusted quite well after a slow start and from March (ish) last year has proved to be probably our best option with Wharton.

Did well in both Wembley games, and that for me means he can't be considered a bad buy.
He does divide option though, more than most players

 

[Team of the (20)80s]

Hughes is at his best when he has a run of games and gets into his rhythm.
Stops and starts and bit part roles don't do him any favours.
Nonetheless, he never lets the team down.

Kamada is a different type of player and offers a different skillset which brings a lot to the team.

I like Hughes but he had a pretty settled run in the team whilst Kamada was out. Over sixish weeks between mid-December and February 1st he played nine games (45 minutes or more in 7 of them) - we drew three and lost six. Not solely his fault of course but he was pretty poor.

I get some of the criticism of Kamada (he is not consistent) but cannot see a logical argument as to why Hughes should start ahead of him in our strongest side.

 

[TheBigToePunt]

Sometimes.

He also picks up a huge amount of them diving into stupid tackles that he doesn't need to make.

And for tripping up opponents immediately possession changes hands.

Because if modern football knows anything, it's that it's safer to drink boiling paint in a shark tank than to face the mortal danger posed when an average player in a mid table side gets half a chance to possibly start an attack against your team.

Trusting your defenders to defend, all running back to help, and especially seeing if it's possible to tackle the bloke properly instead of fouling him are all very, very old fashioned and betray a total failure to understand the modern game. Ask any statistician. Or Will Hughes. When he's suspended.

 

[Faz]

IMO the team doesn't function with a midfield of Hughes and Lerma. That first half yesterday was devoid of any midfield control. I dont dislike either of them, but they are limited in terms of what they can add to the team. They are bottom half scrappers. We have to aspire to more technically

Fully agree - I’m afraid to say Hughes lack of speed is an issue & he’s slowing down more. He is finding it hard to compete this season & hard to impact a game from a crucial position

 

[park the bus]

I've always thought that Hughes is, when on his game, an average player, not particularly creative and definitely never a goal threat, ok at patrolling his given area but slow and clumsy in the tackle. Now this is all very fine if his qualities are what is required, but only if he is paired with a creative type - certainly not with someone like Lerma, who himself has certain useful qualities best utilised in combination with a more creative player.
This is an elaborate way of saying that it's all about team balance and creativity in my book, and I prefer Kamada in that role.

 

[Eaglecoops]

Kamada compared to Hughes is night and day, yes Kamada at times can give the worse fouls on edge of our own box etc and he’s been a scapegoat so many times, but he’s so much more positive and more creative. In 2024 run in when Hughes was next to Wharton , we had Olise who was creative, clinical and with Eze also them 2 were scaring teams for fun. We all love Hughes but he’s not a starting 11 player for us as he doesn’t offer much apart from leadership, and that won’t bring assists or contribution to goals.

As a matter of interest, how many assists and goals has Kamada created/scored since he joined?

I decided to look it up and answer my own question, 1 assist and no goals in two seasons.

Ozoh has improved at Derby and is well liked by their fans. He could become the engine room in a 2 man midfield for us next season but I think it’s more likely we will play with a midfield 3. Ironically I think Kamada would have been a more influential player in a midfield 3. Hackney as replacement for Kamada would be good business.

 

[MrRobbo]

As a matter of interest, how many assists and goals has Kamada created/scored since he joined?

I decided to look it up and answer my own question, 1 assist and no goals in two seasons.

Ozoh has improved at Derby and is well liked by their fans. He could become the engine room in a 2 man midfield for us next season but I think it’s more likely we will play with a midfield 3. Ironically I think Kamada would have been a more influential player in a midfield 3. Hackney as replacement for Kamada would be good business.

Its a fair point, and you'd of course expect some.

But its worth keeping in mind that primarily, his and Wharton's job is to screen and to provide the transition. Alongside the 3 CBs the are essentially the defensive 5 of the team, where the front 3 and wing backs are the attacking 5.

Kamada often plays a critical role in the build up to goals. Never the assist, but often the pre-assist, or -re-pre assist.

Agree on Hackney, think he's got the right profile, and Kees Smitt. For me the focus needs be be on technical ability, the prem no longer needs midfield 'enforcers'

 

[CPFCSaturn]

Its a fair point, and you'd of course expect some.

But its worth keeping in mind that primarily, his and Wharton's job is to screen and to provide the transition. Alongside the 3 CBs the are essentially the defensive 5 of the team, where the front 3 and wing backs are the attacking 5.

Kamada often plays a critical role in the build up to goals. Never the assist, but often the pre-assist, or -re-pre assist.

Agree on Hackney, think he's got the right profile, and Kees Smitt. For me the focus needs be be on technical ability, the prem no longer needs midfield 'enforcers'

It's been said a million times, but it's no coincidence that none of our 4 midfielders contribute with goals - that's clearly a system 'issue' as much as anything.

I think it's perfectly reasonable to say Kamada should've contributed a few more goals by now, but I also don't think the system would ever allow it to be more than a few.

 

[taylors lovechild]

My view hasn't ever changed on Kamada. He's a good technical player who keeps the ball ticking over, but hasn't contributed anywhere near enough. When he leaves, I think he'll be quickly forgotten. It's a shame, as performances like last Thursday show he could have done so much more.

 

[palace99]

Its a fair point, and you'd of course expect some.

But its worth keeping in mind that primarily, his and Wharton's job is to screen and to provide the transition. Alongside the 3 CBs the are essentially the defensive 5 of the team, where the front 3 and wing backs are the attacking 5.

Kamada often plays a critical role in the build up to goals. Never the assist, but often the pre-assist, or -re-pre assist.

Agree on Hackney, think he's got the right profile, and Kees Smitt. For me the focus needs be be on technical ability, the prem no longer needs midfield 'enforcers'

you've mentioned this before and i feel it is not 100% true.

Yes when we defend we have two No6's but when we attack we have more freedom as they know they have an extra defender behind.

As per any midfield two one has licence to go forward when we attack. I'd say their position is a combined 6 and 8 (clearly not a 10) .

Others in that position for other teams who sit in front of 2 CBS usually score a couple a season.

Our four haven't scored one between them - this is a damning stat