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Reform

georgenorman said:
Well, Steeleye has been unable or unwilling to enlighten us as to how his alternative economy will function, perhaps you could have a try?
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What's the point. You've demonstrated that you aren't actually interested in such things, your only game is to try and make others do leg work so you can mock them in a sentence regardless of whether you understand the point or not.

That you can't see that trickledown is based on your hope whilst the very rich scrape ever increasing amounts from those below them says a lot about your comprehensive ability. You've been convinced that any form of government support is scrounging yet aren't bothered even slightly by corporate subsidy which amounts to 50 times the money spent on the unemployed, though I suspect it's because you don't know or want to know.

You remind me of that prat Clarkson. In a recent episode he banged on about his disgust for socialism and not 5 minutes later is sat down with Charlie talking about his ways to get money off the government.
 
Spindle said:
What's the point. You've demonstrated that you aren't actually interested in such things, your only game is to try and make others do leg work so you can mock them in a sentence regardless of whether you understand the point or not.

That you can't see that trickledown is based on your hope whilst the very rich scrape ever increasing amounts from those below them says a lot about your comprehensive ability. You've been convinced that any form of government support is scrounging yet aren't bothered even slightly by corporate subsidy which amounts to 50 times the money spent on the unemployed, though I suspect it's because you don't know or want to know.

You remind me of that prat Clarkson. In a recent episode he banged on about his disgust for socialism and not 5 minutes later is sat down with Charlie talking about his ways to get money off the government.
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But, to his credit, he has also said that he cannot be in the same room as someone who still supports Brexit.
 
They are still remoaning.

Forty years the EU crowd denied the anti EU crowd a vote on Brexit, even though the polls often and regularly showed a preference for leaving the EU.

Forty years.

So fair's fair, you guys only have another 31 years to go.

Deserved.
 
Stirlingsays said:
They are still remoaning.

Forty years the EU crowd denied the anti EU crowd a vote on Brexit, even though the polls often and regularly showed a preference for leaving the EU.

Forty years.

So fair's fair, you guys only have another 31 years to go.

Deserved.
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For forty years the democratic process we use in the UK worked properly!

Parliament decided, as they should. Referendums have no status whatsoever in UK politics. They can only ever be advisory. Whether Parliament decides to seek the opinion of the people, or not, is their decision. As is whether they act on that opinion. We elect representatives. Not delegates.

The bs expressed above might be a commonly held misconception, but misconception it still is, as it always was.
 
Stirlingsays said:
They are still remoaning.

Forty years the EU crowd denied the anti EU crowd a vote on Brexit, even though the polls often and regularly showed a preference for leaving the EU.

Forty years.

So fair's fair, you guys only have another 31 years to go.

Deserved.
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Was this a poll of ukip members?
 
Spindle said:
Was this a poll of ukip members?
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Yeah, that's right, only Ukip members voted in 2016 to leave the EU.....You know that campaign that had most of government and the opposition and most of business and televisual media behind it pushing the remain message, telling us that we would be in nearly instant recession otherwise (Germany is in recession by the way).

Yet remain still lost.

Yeah, just Ukip supporters apparently.....everyone else just loved what the EU were doing.

Sigh.
 
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Stirlingsays said:
Yeah, that's right, only Ukip members voted in 2016 to leave the EU.....You know that campaign that had most of government and the opposition and most of business and televisual media behind it pushing the remain message, telling us that we would be in nearly instant recession otherwise (Germany are in recession by the way).

Yet remain still lost.

Yeah, just Ukip supporters apparently.....everyone else just loved what the EU were doing.

Sigh.
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You can argue that the predictions were wrong on both sides! Where was the “oven ready deal” and avalanche of beneficial trade deals? What you cannot argue is that overall Brexit has delivered more benefits to us, than negatives. Indeed any benefits are very hard to see, beyond the entirely worthless “taking back control”. Aka adding more costs.

That though wasn’t the issue. The issue was the idea that we should have held referendums during our years of membership, just because some, or even a majority, of the voters were unhappy. If we always did that what would be the point of elected representatives? We should just govern by popular opinion as directed by Murdoch and Harmsworth.
 
Spindle said:
What's the point. You've demonstrated that you aren't actually interested in such things, your only game is to try and make others do leg work so you can mock them in a sentence regardless of whether you understand the point or not.

That you can't see that trickledown is based on your hope whilst the very rich scrape ever increasing amounts from those below them says a lot about your comprehensive ability. You've been convinced that any form of government support is scrounging yet aren't bothered even slightly by corporate subsidy which amounts to 50 times the money spent on the unemployed, though I suspect it's because you don't know or want to know.

You remind me of that prat Clarkson. In a recent episode he banged on about his disgust for socialism and not 5 minutes later is sat down with Charlie talking about his ways to get money off the government.
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I took your advice and Googled alternatives to Capitalism and three options came up a lot, Socialism, Communism and Anarchy. Which should we go for?
Where have I said “any form of government support is scrounging”?
Subsidies? 24.6% of the budget of your beloved EU goes to farming, it was 73.2% in 1980. France is the biggest recipient.
Many of the unemployed choose to be unemployed.
Clarkson is quite right to take advantage of any government funds that he is eligible for, it is part of running a sound business to do so. He of course no doubt pays very large sums in taxation.
Did he say ‘disgust’, I don’t know, haven’t seen it – why do you watch him if you think he is a prat? Certainly Socialism is bad for everyone.
 
silvertop said:
But, to his credit, he has also said that he cannot be in the same room as someone who still supports Brexit.
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Funny, since the worst thing about Brexit was the failure to implement it properly.
 
Stirlingsays said:
They are still remoaning.

Forty years the EU crowd denied the anti EU crowd a vote on Brexit, even though the polls often and regularly showed a preference for leaving the EU.

Forty years.

So fair's fair, you guys only have another 31 years to go.

Deserved.
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I am rubbing my eyes in disbelief.

Are you actually saying you STILL support Leave!?! Really? In 2016, perhaps. But now? In the face of all the irrefutable evidence that has been presented?

Two thirds of those who voted Leave would still do so today i.e. the entrenched % who one side took for granted in 2016 and who the other side could never shift. Quite a few of them on here. They are people who intentionally shot one foot off and now aim the other barrel at the other foot by drifting to Reform. They are beyond all help or hope and when they argue "betrayal", "poor execution" or other revisionist cobblers, you just have to give them a comforting smile and move on.

What that stat also means is that a huge chunk of "not sure" voters who swung Leave now deeply regret their decision and would not vote Leave today.

That means that, no matter how you gloat, we are now a nation who, by majority, wish we were back in the tenant but have to suffer standing out in the rain with you lot!
 
silvertop said:
I am rubbing my eyes in disbelief.

Are you actually saying you STILL support Leave!?! Really? In 2016, perhaps. But now? In the face of all the irrefutable evidence that has been presented?

Two thirds of those who voted Leave would still do so today i.e. the entrenched % who one side took for granted in 2016 and who the other side could never shift. Quite a few of them on here. They are people who intentionally shot one foot off and now aim the other barrel at the other foot by drifting to Reform. They are beyond all help or hope and when they argue "betrayal", "poor execution" or other revisionist cobblers, you just have to give them a comforting smile and move on.

What that stat also means is that a huge chunk of "not sure" voters who swung Leave now deeply regret their decision and would not vote Leave today.

That means that, no matter how you gloat, we are now a nation who, by majority, wish we were back in the tenant but have to suffer standing out in the rain with you lot!
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This thread is entitled "Reform". Much of the support for Reform is because they will not try, like the other parties, to take us back into the undemocratic, price-fixing, protectionist racket that is the EU.
 
georgenorman said:
This thread is entitled "Reform". Much of the support for Reform is because they will not try, like the other parties, to take us back into the undemocratic, price-fixing, protectionist racket that is the EU.
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It’s also the same people that seem to want to blow up any form of normality we have, and then when it happens, have no idea how to f*cking fix it and move on to their next bogeyman instead and leave the actual adults to try and clean up the mess.
 
DanH said:
It’s also the same people that seem to want to blow up any form of normality we have, and then when it happens, have no idea how to f*cking fix it and move on to their next bogeyman instead and leave the actual adults to try and clean up the mess.
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You guys blew up normality years ago.
 
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