Israel v Hamas

[Living In Hope]

If you did that you would be arrested. Taking the law into your own hands is not an option. That though doesn’t mean you cannot do something and not just stand back. You do have opinions. You can make a citizens arrest. A shop keeper can lock the doors and call the police. You can use CCTV to record events to help identify criminals and support insurance claims. If violence is used it can be met with proportionate resistance.

I have been taught to face down and humiliate bullies by turning aside and ignoring them. They are at heart attention seeking cowards. If everyone ignores them they fail.

You are right, I would be arrested. You are perhaps more even-tempered on these issues than me, and perhaps your approach would work better than mine. But I have experienced police refusal to deal with low-level crime first-hand quite a lot in recent times, and I think many people are being driven to desperation.

 

[Daddyorc]

The aid was offered. Hamas nicked it

Ok, maybe Hamas nicked some of the aid. But the strategy of starving a population of 2 million because you want to starve a few thousand (maybe 10s) of enemy fighters is just cruel and inhumane.

There's only so much food the fighters can nick and eat. They can't sell it to the population. So what, they have their own distribution centers? These people aren't idiots, they know where the food comes from. If anything this can be used against them. The current strategy is just breeding a new wave of fighters (unless they're starved to death).

 

[Penge Eagle]

No other modern conflict has seen one side continue to deliver aid to the territory that is controlled by its enemy while the war ongoing. Nobody mentions this.

Egypt only allows limited aid trucks through its border and is refusing to take in refugees. Egypt has actually expanded its border wall and buffer zone with Gaza as the country is a threat. Nobody mentions this.

 

[Wisbech Eagle]

Just look at the campaign by the BBC. EVERY story is about the Gazans being victims of the Jews, not one single mention of Hamas being anything to do with it. 16 about Israeli aggression, 1 even having a go at Israel for striking Iran!!!! It's unbelievable.

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There were plenty of stories about Hamas when it was them being the obvious aggressor. That’s no longer true. The stories now are about Israeli tactics and the consequences.

That’s undeniable, despite the whataboutery that some want to use to muddy the water. There is no need to constantly state the obvious about Hamas, what they are and what they do is well known. What’s new are the Israeli responses.

 

[Wisbech Eagle]

No other modern conflict has seen one side continue to deliver aid to the territory that is controlled by its enemy while the war ongoing. Nobody mentions this.

Egypt only allows limited aid trucks through its border and is refusing to take in refugees. Egypt has actually expanded its border wall and buffer zone with Gaza as the country is a threat. Nobody mentions this.

Israel already totally controls 70% of Gaza and has total control of its airspace. It also controls all border crossings, including Rafah.

So Israel controls the transfer of all aid into Gaza. You don’t mention this.

Only people are allowed through Rafah from Egypt. Rafah is controlled by Israel. You don’t mention this.

 

[CPFCSaturn]

Oh dear, I think your defence of the undefenceble, is to be admired, but, why are you doing it on a football forum? Go out there, shout as loud as you can, feel better about yourself. You know you wont tho.

WTF is this 🤣

 

[CPFCSaturn]

Just look at the campaign by the BBC. EVERY story is about the Gazans being victims of the Jews, not one single mention of Hamas being anything to do with it. 16 about Israeli aggression, 1 even having a go at Israel for striking Iran!!!! It's unbelievable.

Middle East | Latest News & Updates | BBC News

Get all the latest news, live updates and content about the Middle East from across the BBC.

www.bbc.co.uk

Because anyone with just some basic common sense would realise that what Israel are doing has very little to do with Hamas anymore.

I know some on here think it's a reasonable argument to spend the best part of 2 years repeating 'what about Hamas?' to any and every criticism of Israel, but in the real world no one takes that remotely seriously.

The world knows what Israel is, even if you're still in denial.

 

[Penge Eagle]

Israel already totally controls 70% of Gaza and has total control of its airspace. It also controls all border crossings, including Rafah.

So Israel controls the transfer of all aid into Gaza. You don’t mention this.

Only people are allowed through Rafah from Egypt. Rafah is controlled by Israel. You don’t mention this.

We know Israel controls the airspace - what's your point?

“It also controls all border crossings, including Rafah.”

This is false. The Rafah crossing is controlled by Egypt. The Karem Shalom crossing is jointly controlled.

“Only people are allowed through Rafah from Egypt.”

Again wrong. Both aid and people are allowed through.

 

[georgenorman]

It's a war between Israel and Islamic Fundamentalism. Who do you want to win?

 

[Penge Eagle]

It's a war between Israel and Islamic Fundamentalism. Who do you want to win?

💯

 

[Spindle]

Ok, maybe Hamas nicked some of the aid. But the strategy of starving a population of 2 million because you want to starve a few thousand (maybe 10s) of enemy fighters is just cruel and inhumane.

There's only so much food the fighters can nick and eat. They can't sell it to the population. So what, they have their own distribution centers? These people aren't idiots, they know where the food comes from. If anything this can be used against them. The current strategy is just breeding a new wave of fighters (unless they're starved to death).

That's your conclusion? Don't you think that it might also work that making a scene like this is great anti Jew propaganda?

There was enough food before, Hamas have weaponised it, the IDF didn't.

I dunno, but I think if I wanted to genocide I might drop a couple of CBU-105's right over the heads of that crowd. But they don't, do they.

 

[Daddyorc]

No other modern conflict has seen one side continue to deliver aid to the territory that is controlled by its enemy while the war ongoing. Nobody mentions this.

Egypt only allows limited aid trucks through its border and is refusing to take in refugees. Egypt has actually expanded its border wall and buffer zone with Gaza as the country is a threat. Nobody mentions this.

This isn’t a traditional war. It has turned into a siege like battle, where one side controls basic supplies and the other sides civilians are made to suffer.

When was the last siege? Leningrad?

 

[Spindle]

Because anyone with just some basic common sense would realise that what Israel are doing has very little to do with Hamas anymore.

I know some on here think it's a reasonable argument to spend the best part of 2 years repeating 'what about Hamas?' to any and every criticism of Israel, but in the real world no one takes that remotely seriously.

The world knows what Israel is, even if you're still in denial.

What a swerve. It's not about Hamas, it's about BALANCED REPORTING ffs

 

[beak]

No other modern conflict has seen one side continue to deliver aid to the territory that is controlled by its enemy while the war ongoing. Nobody mentions this.

Egypt only allows limited aid trucks through its border and is refusing to take in refugees. Egypt has actually expanded its border wall and buffer zone with Gaza as the country is a threat. Nobody mentions this.

A very good point well made, the Egyptians are avoiding the Western disease of importing terrorists into their country, give or take Iran Hamas have very few sympathisers on the International stage,they by climbing the wall,raping,killing and hostage taking have caused this mess and the people of Gaza are the sufferers.To be honest when I first went to school lesson one was do not kick the big playground bully up the hacienda then run away and expect no retribution.

 

[CPFCSaturn]

What a swerve. It's not about Hamas, it's about BALANCED REPORTING ffs

Yeah, a real swerve directly answering your point ffs.

So what would a 'balanced' report say?

'Today Israel killed 100 civilians and another 4 children starved to death. Hamas are also terrorists.'

Again, outside of your Zionist bubble, no one is silly enough to pretend Hamas are remotely relevant to Israel's recent conduct.

 

[beak]

Yeah, a real swerve directly answering your point ffs.

So what would a 'balanced' report say?

'Today Israel killed 100 civilians and another 4 children starved to death. Hamas are also terrorists.'

Again, outside of your Zionist bubble, no one is silly enough to pretend Hamas are remotely relevant to Israel's recent conduct.

Their actions of climbing the wall,raping,killing and taking hostages started the ball rolling they are not lily white in all this!you sowed the wind, and now you reap the whirlwind" Arthur Harris

 

[CPFCSaturn]

Their actions of climbing the wall,raping,killing and taking hostages started the ball rolling they are not lily white in all this!you sowed the wind, and now you reap the whirlwind" Arthur Harris

You'll note I said recent conduct.

But sure, back round in circles we go.

Yes, October 7th was horrific - Hamas were correctly widely condemned from all corners.

It obviously doesn't give Israel free reign to massacre and starve as many civilians as they see fit in response, hence the condemnation from most of the world.

 

[beak]

You'll note I said recent conduct.

But sure, back round in circles we go.

Yes, October 7th was horrific - Hamas were correctly widely condemned from all corners.

It obviously doesn't give Israel free reign to massacre and starve as many civilians as they see fit in response, hence the condemnation from most of the world.

I used Arthur Harris quite deliberately to highlight that the country attacked will fight back and barbarically if they have suffered severely,Londoners in the main cheered Harris and his carpet bombing campaigns.

 

[CPFCSaturn]

I used Arthur Harris quite deliberately to highlight that the country attacked will fight back and barbarically if they have suffered severely,Londoners in the main cheered Harris and his carpet bombing campaigns.

I don't mean this dismissively, but I'd suggest you read some of the thread as this is very much covering old ground - October 7th is approaching two years away; does your logic mean that Israel can continue starving and attacking Palestine forever more?

 

[beak]

I don't mean this dismissively, but I'd suggest you read some of the thread as this is very much covering old ground - October 7th is approaching two years away; does your logic mean that Israel can continue starving and attacking Palestine forever more?

I would like a quick settlement food in, hostages home and a plan that both sides can settle for with an enduring peace.I have read a lot but it is 171pages probably a lot of repetition just giving my take, we are not polls apart.