Immigration

[georgenorman]

Really?

You post silly responses to my comments, which add nothing to the debate on the actual subject, yet aren’t provoked!

Claiming that the majority views expressed here reflect the views of most people is so clearly untrue as to be quite funny. Even the most blinkered right winger doesn’t actually believe that. They take pride in being the minority who know the truth!

Most don’t care that much, they are too busy just living to bother, but if pressed most are middle of the road pragmatists.

Now perhaps we can return to the subject?

Yes, lets return to the subject, immigration. Are you seriously suggesting that the majority of people in this country share your views on it? Even the most blinkered One Nation Tory doesn't actually believe that.

 

[Stirlingsays]

I mean it's literally Reform leading in the polls by some margin.

Reform are the most socially conservative party in the country by some margin.

Many of their views chime with posters here.

Sure, there are posters like myself who are more in tune with Rupert Lowe and Ben Habib (as are most of the Reform base) but so what.

You get progressives slavishly staying with Labour and whinging about Starmer calling him the Daily Starmer all the time. So it's no different.

At least the right actually had the balls to split.....those whiney cowards don't do it.

All mainstream parties take their base for granted and try to strip some of the centre away.......No purist likes it but until the gloves are off this is how it is.

 

[Wisbech Eagle]

Yes, lets return to the subject, immigration. Are you seriously suggesting that the majority of people in this country share your views on it? Even the most blinkered One Nation Tory doesn't actually believe that.

I do.

My views are almost certainly not what you think they are, though.

I want illegal immigration stopped as much as the next person. It's a cruel trade in vulnerable people. The problem is not the desire, it's the way it can be achieved. Whilst a demand exists, unscrupulous people will exploit it. Remove the demand and the problem disappears, but that's unattainable. So detecting and arresting those behind it is the only answer. That demands international cooperation so it can be cut off at source and all the way down the supply chains.

I approve of controlled legal migration of those with the skills needed in our economy, whilst there are shortages. Eliminate the shortages, and you eliminate the need for this too. I approve of students from overseas using our Universities just as I do our citizens going abroad to study. International experience of other cultures helps us create a world of understanding. I approve of family migration. Families need to be together, and love doesn't stop at country borders.

That is what I believe most people think too.

 

[Badger11]

Labour should look to socialist Denmark, the ruling socialist party has clamped on on the abuse of the immigration system because as they feel it hurts their own poor. Hurrah about time a socialist party started worrying about its own people.

 

[georgenorman]

I do.

My views are almost certainly not what you think they are, though.

I want illegal immigration stopped as much as the next person. It's a cruel trade in vulnerable people. The problem is not the desire, it's the way it can be achieved. Whilst a demand exists, unscrupulous people will exploit it. Remove the demand and the problem disappears, but that's unattainable. So detecting and arresting those behind it is the only answer. That demands international cooperation so it can be cut off at source and all the way down the supply chains.

I approve of controlled legal migration of those with the skills needed in our economy, whilst there are shortages. Eliminate the shortages, and you eliminate the need for this too. I approve of students from overseas using our Universities just as I do our citizens going abroad to study. International experience of other cultures helps us create a world of understanding. I approve of family migration. Families need to be together, and love doesn't stop at country borders.

That is what I believe most people think too.

Of course they don't. Check out a few opinion polls.

 

[Eagleman13]

We are witnessing the latest Democrat effort to overthrow the USA and democracy.

At the risk of being told i'm posting unsubstantiated bollox, according to an Uncle of mine who lives in a suburb of Albany(State Capital of NY), called Troy, some of the 'rioters' were paid $1250 each to cause as much damage as possible. The name of a guy called George Soros & his son(Alex?) have been implicated, as well as other un-named people.

I do not know how to link/copy the report video he put up, so can't show you all what i mean. I'm sure there are far better 'techno's' out there that could.

EDIT: Found something to back me up, get in!

Three Protesters Arrested in LA Will Turn State’s Evidence Against George and Alex Soros for Paying Them

In a shocking twist out of Los Angeles, three protesters arrested during a recent clash with police outside the Israeli consulate have reportedly agreed to turn state’s evidence — and …

dunning-kruger-times.com

 

[ASCPFC]

Labour should look to socialist Denmark, the ruling socialist party has clamped on on the abuse of the immigration system because as they feel it hurts their own poor. Hurrah about time a socialist party started worrying about its own people.

Indeed, been going on a while. They also only took what they considered a reasonable amount of Ukrainians. A couple of hundred I believe. It's never spoken about in our media - as it's a far nicer country where people feel safer, and are happier. But they're not just letting any unvetted people in, no way.

 

[DanH]

At the risk of being told i'm posting unsubstantiated bollox, according to an Uncle of mine who lives in a suburb of Albany(State Capital of NY), called Troy, some of the 'rioters' were paid $1250 each to cause as much damage as possible. The name of a guy called George Soros & his son(Alex?) have been implicated, as well as other un-named people.

I do not know how to link/copy the report video he put up, so can't show you all what i mean. I'm sure there are far better 'techno's' out there that could.

EDIT: Found something to back me up, get in!

Three Protesters Arrested in LA Will Turn State’s Evidence Against George and Alex Soros for Paying Them

In a shocking twist out of Los Angeles, three protesters arrested during a recent clash with police outside the Israeli consulate have reportedly agreed to turn state’s evidence — and …

dunning-kruger-times.com

This is amazing. 11/10. Standing up applauding and removing my hat at the same time.

(Read the article, Eagleman).

 

[georgenorman]

Indeed, been going on a while. They also only took what they considered a reasonable amount of Ukrainians. A couple of hundred I believe. It's never spoken about in our media - as it's a far nicer country where people feel safer, and are happier. But they're not just letting any unvetted people in, no way.

Apart from the entire population of the EU that as members they are obliged to let in to be 'expanded and enhanced'.

 

[DanH]

Apart from the entire population of the EU that as members they are obliged to let in to be 'expanded and enhanced'.

So Wisbech is the troll but this, most of your other posts, and now your signature on here are all dedicated to him?

Rent free.

 

[georgenorman]

So Wisbech is the troll but this, most of your other posts, and now your signature on here are all dedicated to him?

Rent free.

It's just such a characteristic quote from the Sage, shame to let it sink into obscurity.

 

[ASCPFC]

Apart from the entire population of the EU that as members they are obliged to let in to be 'expanded and enhanced'.

I can understand the viewpoint but have a look into it. Denmark control their borders however they like. That's why we never, ever hear about it. They opted out of the currency, they opted out of policing, they opted out of citizenship and migration.

 

[georgenorman]

I can understand the viewpoint but have a look into it. Denmark control their borders however they like. That's why we never, ever hear about it. They opted out of the currency, they opted out of policing, they opted out of citizenship and migration.

Are they not subject to free movement of people in the EU?

 

[ASCPFC]

Are they not subject to free movement of people in the EU?

I can say for sure that all passports are checked. They're not part of the overall EU thing, they're that second part I believe - but I could be wrong. As far as I know, EU people are free to go there. However, there is a visa requirement for more than 90 days I believe. I remember them hassling me when they couldn't see my leaving Denmark stamp (it was feint) looked like I'd overstayed.
There is no entitlement to benefits as such until earned. Five years I believe. They seem to not be covered entirely by the treaties as they seem to have used their own legislation to counteract it. As far as I can tell, they are not covered by EU courts so can kick out who they like. They seem pretty much to be doing whatever they like - which I agree with.

 

[DanH]

I can say for sure that all passports are checked. They're not part of the overall EU thing, they're that second part I believe - but I could be wrong. As far as I know, EU people are free to go there. However, there is a visa requirement for more than 90 days I believe. I remember them hassling me when they couldn't see my leaving Denmark stamp (it was feint) looked like I'd overstayed.
There is no entitlement to benefits as such until earned. Five years I believe. They seem to not be covered entirely by the treaties as they seem to have used their own legislation to counteract it. As far as I can tell, they are not covered by EU courts so can kick out who they like. They seem pretty much to be doing whatever they like - which I agree with.

Yep. Total ‘freedom of movement’ within the EU is, and has always been, a myth. Most governments just can’t be arsed to enforce the restrictions (admittedly a lot more difficult to do in Schengen area but way easier for us as an island - will Britain anyway).

Was ridiculous why this wasn’t highlighted more in the lead up to the referendum.

• For stays of under three months: the only requirement for EU citizens is that they possess a valid identity document or passport. The host Member State may require the persons concerned to register their presence in the country.
• For stays of over three months: EU citizens and their family members – if not working – must have sufficient resources and sickness insurance to ensure that they do not become a burden on the social services of the host Member State during their stay. EU citizens do not need residence permits, although Member States may require them to register with the authorities. Family members of EU citizens who are not nationals of a Member State must apply for a residence permit, valid for the duration of their stay or a five-year period.
• Right of permanent residence: EU citizens acquire this right after a five-year period of uninterrupted legal residence, provided that an expulsion decision has not been enforced against them. This right is no longer subject to any conditions. The same rule applies to family members who are not nationals of a Member State and who have lived with an EU citizen for five years. The right of permanent residence is lost only in the event of more than two successive years’ absence from the host Member State.
• Restrictions on the right of entry and the right of residence: EU citizens or members of their family may be expelled from the host Member State on grounds of public policy, public security or public health. Guarantees are provided to ensure that such decisions are not taken on economic grounds, comply with the proportionality principle and are based on personal conduct, among other considerations.

 

[ASCPFC]

Yep. Total ‘freedom of movement’ within the EU has, and has always been, a myth. Most governments just can’t be arsed to enforce the restrictions (admittedly a lot more difficult to do in Schengen area but way easier for us as an island - will Britain anyway).

Was ridiculous why this wasn’t highlighted more in the lead up to the referendum.

• For stays of under three months: the only requirement for EU citizens is that they possess a valid identity document or passport. The host Member State may require the persons concerned to register their presence in the country.
• For stays of over three months: EU citizens and their family members – if not working – must have sufficient resources and sickness insurance to ensure that they do not become a burden on the social services of the host Member State during their stay. EU citizens do not need residence permits, although Member States may require them to register with the authorities. Family members of EU citizens who are not nationals of a Member State must apply for a residence permit, valid for the duration of their stay or a five-year period.
• Right of permanent residence: EU citizens acquire this right after a five-year period of uninterrupted legal residence, provided that an expulsion decision has not been enforced against them. This right is no longer subject to any conditions. The same rule applies to family members who are not nationals of a Member State and who have lived with an EU citizen for five years. The right of permanent residence is lost only in the event of more than two successive years’ absence from the host Member State.
• Restrictions on the right of entry and the right of residence: EU citizens or members of their family may be expelled from the host Member State on grounds of public policy, public security or public health. Guarantees are provided to ensure that such decisions are not taken on economic grounds, comply with the proportionality principle and are based on personal conduct, among other considerations.

One of the things I notice is that I've only ever been checked once going to the UK. That was during COVID. Every other time everyone just breezes in. I've been maybe twenty or thirty times in the last few years. I go twice a season to the football and other times for family things.
When I come to Ireland, go to Spain, France, Denmark, Germany - I'm always fully checked. What's going on there? Makes it feel like a policy.

 

[DanH]

One of the things I notice is that I've only ever been checked once going to the UK. That was during COVID. Every other time everyone just breezes in. I've been maybe twenty or thirty times in the last few years. I go twice a season to the football and other times for family things.
When I come to Ireland, go to Spain, France, Denmark, Germany - I'm always fully checked. What's going on there? Makes it feel like a policy.

It’s the Common Travel Area - essentially UK and Ireland’s Schengen.

Common Travel Area: rights of UK and Irish citizens

Information for UK and Irish citizens on their rights under the Common Travel Area arrangements (CTA).

www.gov.uk

 

[eaglesdare]

One of the things I notice is that I've only ever been checked once going to the UK. That was during COVID. Every other time everyone just breezes in. I've been maybe twenty or thirty times in the last few years. I go twice a season to the football and other times for family things.
When I come to Ireland, go to Spain, France, Denmark, Germany - I'm always fully checked. What's going on there? Makes it feel like a policy.

I think it's the common travel area flying to UK from Ireland.

Strange tho when coming back from the likes of Spain/ Portugal/ Croatia and maybe others there's passport control at the airports you have to go through in order to actually get to you gate.

 

[ASCPFC]

It’s the Common Travel Area - essentially UK and Ireland’s Schengen.

Common Travel Area: rights of UK and Irish citizens

Information for UK and Irish citizens on their rights under the Common Travel Area arrangements (CTA).

www.gov.uk

I realise that. But I'm always checked in Ireland. What's the difference?

 

[DanH]

I realise that. But I'm always checked in Ireland. What's the difference?

Maybe they’re more thorough!

Either that or you’re on some sort of watch list 🙂