DANGERCLOSE
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Here we go, blatant two tier judiciary
- Topic starter HKOwen
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Stirlingsays
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England
The uniparties are entirely responsible for the footholds that these organisations have taken.
It's just one of so many social failings, essentially their worldview means that all that can ever happen are band-aids.
It's another problem we are stuck with as demographics change and it's entirely down to them.
Band aid raised a lotta money,almost worth putting up with Bob Geldof
Hrolf The Ganger
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All you say is fair, but I do think that religion plays a part in politics in terms of how people vote, or at least, how they are told to vote. It might just be a particular demographic and perceived self interest, but we also now see political movements based purely on religion. This is a predictable and dangerous development.
That has nothing to do with my personal dislike of the worship of sky monkeys but it is a problem where people's hearts and minds can be so easily manipulated towards thinking and activity that is not in the interests of the population as a whole.
Stirlingsays
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When you're talking about a religion, you are essentially referring to a set of morality rules. The good aspect to that is it gives a person's life a purpose....the opium of the masses as the quote goes.
Since the slow drip introduction of science, reason, and skepticism via the enlightenment we have seen the 'death of god' that Nietzsche warned about. We can argue about the nature of truth but what matters more is what replaces religion....and nihilism, suicidal empathy and narcissism aren't building much of a future, even though I may enjoy aspects of the latter.
Western society killed off belief in a transcendent god with a clear morality system to follow, and for both good and ill, we’re stuck wrestling with the fallout.
Hrolf The Ganger
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I don't think we need 'God' to have morals. God is about fear. God is about worship. God is about ignorance.
We have inserted God into human history as a mechanism primarily to achieve adherance to moral discipline and population control, but the concept has not stopped wars, greed and cruelty or and other human failing. In fact it has been the excuse for those on many occasions.
I agree that that void left by religion needs filling but we can't hold on to archaic ideas using that excuse. If we are not careful, we risk simply replacing a moderate religion with another that is far less desirable.
Progressivism is also not the answer. It is not progressive. It is irational. It is driven by a false narrative.
There has to be another way forward.
Stirlingsays
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Ok, but like I say what matters was the replacement.
I think enough time has passed since the fall of widespread religion in the west and what I've seen in its place is essentially replacing 'god' with the self.....Narcissism: the self as 'god'. It's why our children will be poorer than us.
Human failings will happen whether there's a religion to excuse it onto or not. Stalin was an atheist for example, as was Moa. In fact, some religions can reduce the propensity towards violence instead of negotiation....and others, as we know, not so much.
Tribalism is an intrinsic part of human nature and will be expressed whether that's ethnicity or value system and it'll play out wearing different cloaks whether they are coloured religious or not religious.
In the west Christianity is dying faster than BBC comedy. A long enough time has elapsed since Nietzsche spoke about the death of god to have a view on the aftermath.
I agree with you that progressivism is a disaster but I also say that it's an inevitable 'direction of travel' consequence of liberalism. I don't see 'democracy' allowing a change of course and thus we are stuck with it until it falls.
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I think you mean plasters.
Stirlingsays
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You know what, I think you are right.
Nothing is worth that!
Hrolf The Ganger
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I hear you.
I don't think that the rejection of a god concept has to equal nihilism or narcissism. It is merely the rejection of a false, or at best, unprovable premise around which understanding and behaviour is based.
Certainly religion is not the cause of human failings but it is symptomatic of it. If we are to 'evolve' as a species we have to find better reasons to be better. We can blame amoral behaviour on a lack of faith, but I believe that to be equally false. Amorality is generally the natural state of all animals. Our capacity to behave with a moral code presumably comes from our complex reasoning brain. It obviously sees compassion as advantatious in some circumstances. That sort of behaviour can also been seen in other animals on occasion, so it's not specific to us. Despite that, humans are very much animals and part of the problem is that the human concept of what humans are or can be is often not in line with what we actually are. Time and time again we deny our true nature. That is not to say we can't aspire to always be our best selves, but I'm certain that worshipping sky monkeys is not the answer.
As you say, we are tribal, and we are also an aggressive and inquisitive species. Our inquisitiveness when positive is why we have science and the desire to know all that can be known. We can't hold back that desire by holding on to superstitions and ignorance.
Equally, we have to develop a genuine understanding of each other as humans and how to find the mutual benefit in peaceful coexistance. That will never happen why ignorance and irrational ideologies prevail. However, the road to disaster is paved with good intentions. Social liberalism is currently in crisis as it has become totally confused and seems to be achieving the exact opposite of it's ambitions. It has become the thing that it previously rejected.
Nietzsche liked a rant but ultimately, the cultural and moral aspects of Christianity do not have to be thrown out with the rejection of a Biblical supreme being and all the rest of the baloney. Intellectually, it must be clear that these two things are totally separate. I don't think that religion was ever responsible for morals. Morals must have developed out of a need to make behaviour condusive to society. God didn't invent morals. We did. It goes back to the advantages of certain behaviour at certain times.
That won't be lost if we lose the bearded bloke in the clouds.
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DANGERCLOSE
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Home Secretary rejects Sir David Amess inquiry appeal
The family of Sir David Amess say the decision is "unacceptable" and "insulting".
www.bbc.co.uk
DANGERCLOSE
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PalazioVecchio
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Let me try to understand this........
- you can have a system of better justice for 'faith communities'
or
- you can have better faith in the justice system
Choose One ?
- you can have a system of better justice for 'faith communities'
or
- you can have better faith in the justice system
Choose One ?
eaglesdare
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England
If they had sexually assaulted underage kids or had indecent images on their laptops. They would have gotten a suspended sentencing. Or nothing at all....
PalazioVecchio
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And the latest....... On the one hand what he wrote was unpleasant. Especially against Sinn Fein who are undemocratic and still march the streets in military uniforms. On the other hand, have we written the odd nasty comment against Brighton ? And does that merit three and a half years in the slammer ?
www.irishexaminer.com
'Lonely keyboard warrior' jailed for posting videos threatening Mary Lou McDonald and Drew Harris
Sinn Féin leader Mary Lou McDonald said: 'The threat to shoot me 'for free' was the threat of a coward, designed to intimidate me and to encourage others to target me'
www.irishexaminer.com
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Teddy Eagle
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Scotland
Another judge whose finger is pretty far from the pulse.
www.lbc.co.uk
Judge blocked paedophile’s deportation to Pakistan because he 'could be persecuted as an alcoholic'
A Pakistani national labelled a “danger to the community” for committing crimes including sexually abusing a girl under 13 and assaulting emergency workers avoided deportation because of his alcoholism, it has emerged.
www.lbc.co.uk
When I lived in Pakistan, if a local registered as an alcoholic, they could get access to alcohol legally. Another ruling from a judge who is completely out of touch with realityAnother judge whose finger is pretty far from the pulse.
Judge blocked paedophile’s deportation to Pakistan because he 'could be persecuted as an alcoholic'
A Pakistani national labelled a “danger to the community” for committing crimes including sexually abusing a girl under 13 and assaulting emergency workers avoided deportation because of his alcoholism, it has emerged.
Except they are not out of touch. That is the point. The 'reality' is that this Judge can make this decision based on the law as it stands.
If people want this to change then they have to accept that we need a completely new justice system. There is no fixing things as they are. There is no 'reform'.
There is only revolution.
* Agreed.
** Disagree, you talk about revolution why can't we simply change the law? There is no need for a new justice system just a change in the law.
The Tories had 14 years to come up with a solution within or without the European Court of Human Rights and they failed to do so.
Other members of the ECHR don't seem to have problems deporting people so there must be a solution that is fair and firm.