War in Ukraine

[Hrolf The Ganger]

Invoke article 5

NATO would be useless if it didn't act as a group.

Yes, America has a military capability in terms of personnel that equals all the other NATO countries put together, plus an enormous arsenal of weaponry. However, the contributions from other countries, particularly Turkey and Poland, are hugely important strategically.

A show of solidarity also discourages anyone from aggression towards a member state.

 

[Stirlingsays]

NATO would be useless if it didn't act as a group.

Yes, America has a military capability in terms of personnel that equals all the other NATO countries put together, plus an enormous arsenal of weaponry. However, the contributions from other countries, particularly Turkey and Poland, are hugely important strategically.

A show of solidarity also discourages anyone from aggression towards a member state.

The question that needs to be asked from my point of view is how we got here and why are we up for war over Ukraine?

I go back to 1991, I was 22 and the USSR was in fifty percent of Europe (thanks to our involvement in backing Stalin) and ran half of Germany.

Now I agree with Russia being out of East Europe and that happened with the collapse of the Soviets.

What I don't agree with is the march east by Nato and the confrontation with Russia by a push to include Ukraine in Nato......five hours drive to Moscow and placing missiles so close that Russia couldn't respond.

What I want is a Europe that includes Russia so that I can have cheap energy.

Not a lefty Europe with social liberally leaders and a greedy US who want to break up Russia into different states so they can nab resources for themselves.......That's nuts against a nuclear state.

We have been pushed towards war with no inherent gain to the working man and woman and I for one won't just watch it with no comment.

 

[Spindle]

Double plot twist, it was the Poles who cracked the enigma code.
Not the English or Americans.

Lol more total shite.

There were German Poles who first nicked an enigma machine from the factory and got it to the British early, but it went to Bletchley.

Fancy trying to take the glory away from the heroic genius that was Alan Turing.

 

[chris123]

The question that needs to be asked from my point of view is how we got here and why are we up for war over Ukraine?

I go back to 1991, I was 22 and the USSR was in fifty percent of Europe (thanks to our involvement in backing Stalin) and ran half of Germany.

Now I agree with Russia being out of East Europe and that happened with the collapse of the Soviets.

What I don't agree with is the march east by Nato and the confrontation with Russia by a push to include Ukraine in Nato......five hours drive to Moscow and placing missiles so close that Russia couldn't respond.

What I want is a Europe that includes Russia so that I can have cheap energy.

Not a lefty Europe with social liberally leaders and a greedy US who want to break up Russia into different states so they can nab resources for themselves.......That's nuts against a nuclear state.

We have been pushed towards war with no inherent gain to the working man and woman and I for one won't just watch it with no comment.

Italy and Canada both have higher GDPs than Russia.

 

[McAhuna]

Lol more total shite.

There were German Poles who first nicked an enigma machine from the factory and got it to the British early, but it went to Bletchley.

Fancy trying to take the glory away from the heroic genius that was Alan Turing.

Lol - Can you complete a sentence without swearing? Serious anger issues. You should listen to some whale music or something.

Anyway, google is your friend. Turing was a great man and did great work developing their methods, but the Poles were the first to crack the enigma code.
Does that upset you as well? 🤣

 

[Spindle]

What I like is how suddenly Wikipedia and the likes is your friend, when only last week you mocked it as a credible source.

I think the point is that you implied that it was the Poles entirely in an effort to deride our nation again, but I understand the international effort in defeating Germany. Enigma on its own was just a part of intelligence.

 

[McAhuna]

What I like is how suddenly Wikipedia and the likes is your friend, when only last week you mocked it as a credible source.

I think the point is that you implied that it was the Poles entirely, but I understand the international effort in defeating Germany. Enigma on its own was just a part of intelligence.

Err ...that's not Wikipedia.
That's AI

Wrong again. This is quite a run you're on 😆

 

[Spindle]

"and the likes"

Wikipedia is vetted. AI is a search algorithm

 

[Matov]

What I want is a Europe that includes Russia so that I can have cheap energy.

Along with its wider culture and other resources. Euro-Russians are my brothers and sisters. And together with Europe, this continent would be unstoppable. That is the dream vision. And why powers outside of Europe (sadly including the British Foreign Office) are so set on making us fight. A Europe with Russia as part of it would simply be majestic. The global power-house with nothing else coming close.

 

[Hrolf The Ganger]

The question that needs to be asked from my point of view is how we got here and why are we up for war over Ukraine?

I go back to 1991, I was 22 and the USSR was in fifty percent of Europe (thanks to our involvement in backing Stalin) and ran half of Germany.

Now I agree with Russia being out of East Europe and that happened with the collapse of the Soviets.

What I don't agree with is the march east by Nato and the confrontation with Russia by a push to include Ukraine in Nato......five hours drive to Moscow and placing missiles so close that Russia couldn't respond.

What I want is a Europe that includes Russia so that I can have cheap energy.

Not a lefty Europe with social liberally leaders and a greedy US who want to break up Russia into different states so they can nab resources for themselves.......That's nuts against a nuclear state.

We have been pushed towards war with no inherent gain to the working man and woman and I for one won't just watch it with no comment.

Sadly, we missed the boat on that. The opportunity was there, but it was wasted by both sides.

 

[chris123]

Sadly, we missed the boat on that. The opportunity was there, but it was wasted by both sides.

Putin is not a Gorbachev.

 

[Stirlingsays]

Italy and Canada both have higher GDPs than Russia.

So what?

GDP only matters in total war....outside of that it doesn't mean jack when you look into it.

The evidence being how it's played out both in past history and here.

I could go into the detail quite deeply if I were bothered but essentially it boils down to what is considered existential......what are people willing to die for.

The US GDP made Vietnam look like what it was.....a fly on its ass.

The US lost sixty thousand in Vietham over nearly ten years.....We lost more than double that dead in a few months at the Somme.....one battle.

If the US had wanted to it could have beaten Vietham......and it still killed at least 8 to every 1 it lost.

The US didn't win exactly because it wasn't prepared to treat the war as existential (because it wasn't) but for North Vietham it was.

Shouldn't you know all this already?

 

[Stirlingsays]

Sadly, we missed the boat on that. The opportunity was there, but it was wasted by both sides.

Yep.

 

[Stirlingsays]

Putin is not a Gorbachev.

Yeah, he's popular in Russia.....that certainly wasn't Gorbachev.

 

[Stirlingsays]

Along with its wider culture and other resources. Euro-Russians are my brothers and sisters. And together with Europe, this continent would be unstoppable. That is the dream vision. And why powers outside of Europe (sadly including the British Foreign Office) are so set on making us fight. A Europe with Russia as part of it would simply be majestic. The global power-house with nothing else coming close.

Ukrainians are even more European than Russians....as half of Russia is Asian.

On a purely ethnic level I prefer Ukraine......though the Russians we think of are Europeans and....I agree with you that I abhor brother wars.

But Ukraine is now fecked.....completely led down the garden path by a combination of lies and half truths and unrealism....It's going to get the social liberals post war sending it millions of the third world, pride parades and tranny TV shows and primary school lessons.

All those warriors in their graveyards aren't going to be around to fight their real enemies.

 

[chris123]

So what?

GDP only matters in total war....outside of that it doesn't mean jack when you look into it.

The evidence being how it's played out both in past history and here.

I could go into the detail quite deeply if I were bothered but essentially it boils down to what is considered existential......what are people willing to die for.

The US GDP made Vietnam look like what it was.....a fly on its ass.

The US lost sixty thousand in Vietham over nearly ten years.....We lost that in a few days at the Somme.

If the US had wanted to it could have beaten Vietham......and it still killed at least 8 to every 1 it lost.

The US didn't win exactly because it wasn't prepared to treat the war as existential (because it wasn't) but for North Vietham it was.

Shouldn't you know all this already?

I'm giving an opinion, I don't know anymore than most and clearly Russia does not have unlimited funds.

 

[Stirlingsays]

I'm giving an opinion, I don't know anymore than most and clearly Russia does not have unlimited funds.

Haven't you observed the wars of the last sixty years at least?

As for Russia, it has funds enough....because it has resources and interested buyers. It's also taking resource rich land.

Russia's advantage is manpower and resolve.....As Hitler found out.

Their other advantage is that Putin isn't stupid.....whereas in comparison our leaders are....laden down with group think.

 

[chris123]

Haven't you observed the wars of the last sixty years at least?

As for Russia, it has funds enough....because it has resources and interested buyers. It's also taking resource rich land.

Russia's advantage is manpower and resolve.....As Hitler found out.

Their other advantage is that Putin isn't stupid.....whereas in comparison our leaders are....laden down with group think.

Wars need funding, Brent has been low 60 USD for ages and that is a high grade blend, US WTI is priced less as it's a lower grade product. If Saudi needs 90 USD to fund their latest projects I'm struggling to see how Russia can afford to be at war much longer.

 

[McAhuna]

"and the likes"

Wikipedia is vetted. AI is a search algorithm

I find AI a more reliable source of truth and less politically motivated. Wiki has Bill Gate's and Soros' clutches all over it.

For example, AI correctly identifies that Georgia started the military offensive which led to war with Russia.
This was even admitted to by the EU, but Wikipedia lies and parrots Soros propaganda

 

[McAhuna]