Sage is sage

[TheBigToePunt]

Back on topic, it’s good to see Parish give an interview where he recognises the good job our manager is doing in difficult circumstances while also scotching the rumours, mainly coming from that clown Mick Brown, that he was considering sacking him.

Where can I see the interview, please?

I would be interested to know (not that I expect the interview to tell me) whether Parish anticipated such wide reaching change across the course of the summer when he appointed Sage, and if so, why he thought one suited the other. By which I mean, did he weigh up the idea of appointing a 'safe pair of hands' instead?

I still think that will be on Parish' mind if results go a bit wobbly.

 

[ASCPFC]

We started to look better the last few matches but it's the usual international break and injuries to thwart our momentum now. Everything in the season seems to come at the wrong time for us. I think we need to take a look at our pre seasons. The more I think about it, The Como Cup seemed unhelpful. Two or three more proper friendlies would have been better. And to speak to the less involved players to come back maybe five days earlier than they did. Hopefully, this break doesn't set us back, we work well in training, we play the U21s and we get no injuries. It's interesting to see Sage develop his tactics. I still don't fancy us to be a team for the high press, but we'll see.

 

[TheBigToePunt]

We started to look better the last few matches but it's the usual international break and injuries to thwart our momentum now. Everything in the season seems to come at the wrong time for us. I think we need to take a look at our pre seasons. The more I think about it, The Como Cup seemed unhelpful. Two or three more proper friendlies would have been better. And to speak to the less involved players to come back maybe five days earlier than they did. Hopefully, this break doesn't set us back, we work well in training, we play the U21s and we get no injuries. It's interesting to see Sage develop his tactics. I still don't fancy us to be a team for the high press, but we'll see.

Another thread on the forum raises the suggestion that we could possibly go one way or the other this year, as in, either glory through winning the Europa League, or relegation. I don't think that's entirely correct. I think that, in fact, we have all but no chance of winning the Europa League but face as great a risk as ever of going down.

That said, I think a positive outcome no less important than winning another trophy is perhaps at stake.

All these years we have effectively played varying degrees of anti-football to stay in the league. Most experiments with a more open approach led to disaster (FDB) or slow reversion to poor results (Pardew, Vieria too, perhaps?). Glasner was very conservative really, he just had terrific players.

Mostly, we sort of accept that some type of parked bus is sensible, and that tactical conservatism has both saved us from the drop and also led to the best period in our history. At the same time it can be, and often has been, f***ing awful to the extent that many of us also question the point of it all. How many times has one of us said they wouldn't mind going back to the championship just to see some better games?

To me, if Sage can get Palace playing on the front foot, pressing, taking risks, and yet not get battered every week, he will have opened up a new possibility in the wider scheme of things. Perhaps he will prove that we can get the same amount of points and/or 12th place by winning and losing more open, higher scoring games worth watching, rather than by 'respecting the point'.

He doesn't need to get us any higher than we ever got before, or win anything, he just needs to get to the same end place as Pulis, Allardyce, Hodgson and Glasner got us. If he can do that using his methods (presuming he keeps with the high press) then he will have achieved something of great significance, perhaps even more so than Glasner did with the trophies.

Its a risky approach for any manager to take at Palace. For one thing, do we have the players? Will we ever? For another, it is far easier to sack a coach who loses playing open football and replace him with a bus-parker than the other way around, as the first option is the risk-averse one.

Whether Sage can do it (whether it can be done at all) remains unclear. I doubt it, sadly. Still, how great would it be? A mid table Palace side playing open football most weeks in games we can enjoy?!

That is perhaps what is at stake under Sage, and is why I wish him the best of British even more than I do any other Palace manager.

 

[MarkA333]

I completely endorse this post. If we can just survive this season playing attractive football then build from there. I would take this in a heart beat. Forget about all the cups. We can live on the fumes from Wembley and Leipzig. I am enjoying the high press, unfortunately Strand Larsson is only good as a goal hanger. ( nothing really wrong with that apart from the offside trap) Nketiah is just useless. Mateta needs 5 chances to score one goal. Sarr is clinical but sulking. We are unfortunately Palace. We get great moments like the team of the 80’s. Then we win three cups in a year but still we are now among the favourites to be relegated.

Money can’t buy you success, look at Chelsea, Spurs, Man Utd.

Good players get you success. Zaha. Sansom, Ian Wright, Vince Hilaire, Olise, Eze, Guehi.

We need to find good players, therefore the role of the scout is incredibly important. All I know is it’s probably going to the wire whether we survive this year and once you go down there are no guarantees about anything. I hope Parish is fully eyes on this.

 

[PatrickA]

Another thread on the forum raises the suggestion that we could possibly go one way or the other this year, as in, either glory through winning the Europa League, or relegation. I don't think that's entirely correct. I think that, in fact, we have all but no chance of winning the Europa League but face as great a risk as ever of going down.

That said, I think a positive outcome no less important than winning another trophy is perhaps at stake.

All these years we have effectively played varying degrees of anti-football to stay in the league. Most experiments with a more open approach led to disaster (FDB) or slow reversion to poor results (Pardew, Vieria too, perhaps?). Glasner was very conservative really, he just had terrific players.

Mostly, we sort of accept that some type of parked bus is sensible, and that tactical conservatism has both saved us from the drop and also led to the best period in our history. At the same time it can be, and often has been, f***ing awful to the extent that many of us also question the point of it all. How many times has one of us said they wouldn't mind going back to the championship just to see some better games?

To me, if Sage can get Palace playing on the front foot, pressing, taking risks, and yet not get battered every week, he will have opened up a new possibility in the wider scheme of things. Perhaps he will prove that we can get the same amount of points and/or 12th place by winning and losing more open, higher scoring games worth watching, rather than by 'respecting the point'.

He doesn't need to get us any higher than we ever got before, or win anything, he just needs to get to the same end place as Pulis, Allardyce, Hodgson and Glasner got us. If he can do that using his methods (presuming he keeps with the high press) then he will have achieved something of great significance, perhaps even more so than Glasner did with the trophies.

Its a risky approach for any manager to take at Palace. For one thing, do we have the players? Will we ever? For another, it is far easier to sack a coach who loses playing open football and replace him with a bus-parker than the other way around, as the first option is the risk-averse one.

Whether Sage can do it (whether it can be done at all) remains unclear. I doubt it, sadly. Still, how great would it be? A mid table Palace side playing open football most weeks in games we can enjoy?!

That is perhaps what is at stake under Sage, and is why I wish him the best of British even more than I do any other Palace manager.

Bournemouth and Brighton have demonstrated that clubs of that size can play enterprising football and remain competitive.
Bournemouth usually play a 3 man forward line , 2 skilful midfielders in Scott and Kluiivert and have 2 attacking full backs.

There’s also a case to be made for Brentford and Sunderland to be seen as front foot teams, although their games are more direct to exploit the pace and power of their forwards.

My view is that a front 3 of Kamada, Larsen and Pino (as currently deployed due to circumstances) will not seriously trouble defences in the Premier League.
Get Sarr and Mateta playing , and in form, that equation changes.

 

[mileend]

We started to look better the last few matches but it's the usual international break and injuries to thwart our momentum now. Everything in the season seems to come at the wrong time for us. I think we need to take a look at our pre seasons. The more I think about it, The Como Cup seemed unhelpful. Two or three more proper friendlies would have been better. And to speak to the less involved players to come back maybe five days earlier than they did. Hopefully, this break doesn't set us back, we work well in training, we play the U21s and we get no injuries. It's interesting to see Sage develop his tactics. I still don't fancy us to be a team for the high press, but we'll see.

The only advantage of this break is for Mateta to recover from his injury and Sarr to recover from this temporary (hopefully) insanity and get some international game time and a line can be drawn under both after the summer disruption

We need them both to give the best they have for the rest of the season. It does feel like both will fit Sage's system well.

 

[ASCPFC]

The only advantage of this break is for Mateta to recover from his injury and Sarr to recover from this temporary (hopefully) insanity and get some international game time and a line can be drawn under both after the summer disruption

We need them both to give the best they have for the rest of the season. It does feel like both will fit Sage's system well.

It feels like Sarr is necessary as we lack pace. I'm not that sure that our most recent Mateta is any better than Strand-Larsen. I'm starting to think Strand-Larsen is slightly better than Mateta going forward.

 

[Mark B]

I completely endorse this post. If we can just survive this season playing attractive football then build from there. I would take this in a heart beat. Forget about all the cups. We can live on the fumes from Wembley and Leipzig. I am enjoying the high press, unfortunately Strand Larsson is only good as a goal hanger. ( nothing really wrong with that apart from the offside trap) Nketiah is just useless. Mateta needs 5 chances to score one goal. Sarr is clinical but sulking. We are unfortunately Palace. We get great moments like the team of the 80’s. Then we win three cups in a year but still we are now among the favourites to be relegated.

Money can’t buy you success, look at Chelsea, Spurs, Man Utd.

Good players get you success. Zaha. Sansom, Ian Wright, Vince Hilaire, Olise, Eze, Guehi.

We need to find good players, therefore the role of the scout is incredibly important. All I know is it’s probably going to the wire whether we survive this year and once you go down there are no guarantees about anything. I hope Parish is fully eyes on this.

Concur. Money gets you more opportunities to be wrong and still be successful, if you are stupid with all your money then it really doesn't matter how much you because you'll just waste it.

I think one of the things that gets overlooked is consistency of playing style. As you point out, we have a collection of players who do a single thing correctly so they can play in a certain system but that is a lack of continuity in developing and maintaining that system so players are brought in at different times to fit systems that are no longer being utilized. The burning desire by fans/ownership to change coaches more often then they change their underwear makes it so we end up with a random collection instead of talent instead of a cohesive team.

I may be wrong, but I think with time and his type of players being brought in, I think Sage's system can work and we can be one of the better clubs in the league. If we give him time.

 

[Teddy Eagle]

Where can I see the interview, please?

I would be interested to know (not that I expect the interview to tell me) whether Parish anticipated such wide reaching change across the course of the summer when he appointed Sage, and if so, why he thought one suited the other. By which I mean, did he weigh up the idea of appointing a 'safe pair of hands' instead?

I still think that will be on Parish' mind if results go a bit wobbly.

Probably this one.

Crystal Palace: Steve Parish Breaks Silence on Pierre Sage's Future Amid Exit Rumours

Crystal Palace owner Steve Parish has been discussing the start to life at Selhurst Park that Pierre Sage has had.

www.givemesport.com

 

[TheBigToePunt]

Bournemouth and Brighton have demonstrated that clubs of that size can play enterprising football and remain competitive.
Bournemouth usually play a 3 man forward line , 2 skilful midfielders in Scott and Kluiivert and have 2 attacking full backs.

There’s also a case to be made for Brentford and Sunderland to be seen as front foot teams, although their games are more direct to exploit the pace and power of their forwards.

My view is that a front 3 of Kamada, Larsen and Pino (as currently deployed due to circumstances) will not seriously trouble defences in the Premier League.
Get Sarr and Mateta playing , and in form, that equation changes.

Yes, Brighton and Bournemouth do seem to suggest it can be done, albeit that might just be our perception of them from a distance.

Brighton are especially interesting as a case study for us, in that they played absolutely turgid anti-football under Chris Houghton for five years (good years mostly for the club) and then went totally the other way under Potter, playing the most mind-numbingly dull possession-based game. Only later did they find a happy medium. We seem like we might be tyring to go from one tactical extreme to the other with no middle ground in-between.

To be clear, my hope is not that Sage can get us playing higher-risk football so that we could win more often, or even that it would always work. I'd just like to see the team try to play every week, even if it doesn't always work. Its a sport, you're supposed to have a go. Modern football and its finances has killed the spirit of the game, breeding tactics to reflect the financial imbalance and the fear of relegation. It'd be great to break out of that, if it can be done.

I'd be surprised if Larsen, Pino, and Kamada could cause problems for many opponents whatever style of play we adopt, unfortunately. That said, I think they are especially poorly suited to playing on the break at speed, and so perhaps would suit a conservative approach even less. To be fair to Pino, he does seem happy enough to press quickly when he loses the ball. He's had lots of f***ing practice, I suppose....

 

[Palacesince64]

Looks like the full interview was on The Athletic https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/76...sh-crystal-palace-sage-mateta-sarr-interview/