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Israel v Hamas

They're just citizen conscripts don't you understand that? And without them what do you think would happen? Who would the targets be exactly?

The denial is astonishing
 
Spindle said:
Well Hamas has been shafted, you realise that right? But they still control the people, that is unless the people actually support them and what they did still.

"Proportion". Ha ha ha ha ha.

Germany were so unfair in 1940 putting up 6 times the number of aircraft as us. Goering should've limited them. And all that intelligence we cracked with Ultra, for every secret we learned we should've revealed one of our plans to the Abwehr, just to make it fair etc.
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You are so spectacularly constantly missing the point that it’s difficult to reason with you, because you seem blind to it.

The only saving grace is you aren’t alone, which of itself pretty shocking.
 
Wisbech Eagle said:
Try reading my previous posts!

For a start, do you support Israel’s actions unconditionally? If not what do you criticise?
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I have already stated this, but just to humour you... In general I support Israel in the conflict, yes. They will do many wrong things, like any country does when at war. I am unable to determine each action in real time as we get distorted information from a war zone. I find it very peculiar that you are happy to criticise them from your armchair in Cornwall without knowing the full facts. There is no way you can. That says a lot about your prejudice.
 
Wisbech Eagle said:
You are so spectacularly constantly missing the point that it’s difficult to reason with you, because you seem blind to it.

The only saving grace is you aren’t alone, which of itself pretty shocking.
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I didn't miss it, I hit it. It was a really stupid point about proportion. You don't seem to understand that this would be entirely subjective which is why everyone took the piss.

I imagine that your 'proportion' may well have been to approach Hamas and ask them if they wouldn't mind stopping so that we can have a chat and perhaps give them what they want.

I would say that proportion is what the Israeli government decide to do about the largest attack on Jews since WW2. And since we're talking proportion, can you scale this against casualties per capita compared to 9/11 and 7/7??

I've never once celebrated this war though I celebrate the deaths of Hamas officials. What I have said is that because of the Oct 7 attack the Gazans would get what is coming to them, and they have. And I've understood why they are having to do it and what they face. This is called having some awareness and wisdom, I'm not going to turn away from what the Muslims really want when it comes to Jews.
 
Penge Eagle said:
I have already stated this, but just to humour you... In general I support Israel in the conflict, yes. They will do many wrong things, like any country does when at war. I am unable to determine each action in real time as we get distorted information from a war zone. I find it very peculiar that you are happy to criticise them from your armchair in Cornwall without knowing the full facts. There is no way you can. That says a lot about your prejudice.
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You're happy to defend them from your armchair in Penge - what is the difference?

Can Wisbech comment on any world event that happens outside of Cornwall?
 
Wisbech Eagle said:
It’s appalling, unacceptable hate speech but it isn’t Jew hatred. It’s hatred of the Israeli military. Not all Jews, or their religion, nor the individuals tasked to do their duty. There are also Jewish people who oppose the actions of the IDF.
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If a foreign crowd started chanting at a music festival, "Death death to the RAF" then I would think: Why are you saying that about my country and my fellow citizens? And would you be hostile to me? These are natural, quite obvious questions. How do you think a Jew would feel at Glastonbury? People often DO associate citizens with their government - even from the past!

I was talking to a guy on holiday last month from Oman (who part owns Uber) and one of the first things he brought up was Britain as a coloniser. Er, what? I had to remind him that while Britain sought to abolish slavery, Oman kept it up until 1970. These fools don't know anything about history.

So why is "Death death to the IDF" a problem? Well it's a chant that stops just short of "Death death to the Jews". That would be too obvious, wouldn't it. The IDF is made up almost entirely of Jews.

We know antisemites use coded language like "Zionists", "Israeli government", "IDF" as euphemisms to attack Jews without openly saying it.

Have you ever heard the chant “Death to the IRGC” (Iran’s Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps), “Death to Hamas,” “Death to Assad’s army,” or “Death to the Russian military,” despite those groups committing well-documented atrocities? Again, the Jews get special treatment.

And calling death for a specific group encourages real life violence! We have already seen this play out.
 
'In Gaza, we were the N*zis, they were like the jews'.

Harvard student, not welcomed back from his IDF service, but risking expulsion, for what he has said not what he did there, which probably involved blowing up innocent Palestinian women and children.

This type of shut-down also becoming normal in the UK under Count Von Starmer.

For him his aircraft being daubed is far more relevant than 50,000 souls being destroyed and his rotten administration being complicit in.

Supported by the media, police and the courts, now we can experience occupation ourselves (is it like the movies?).

If you are too close to the USA, then you are too close to the Israel lobby, who seem to be running the west anyway.

Over to Mossad BBC HQ, outraged at a chant but not a genocide.

😎
 
Penge Eagle said:
If a foreign crowd started chanting at a music festival, "Death death to the RAF" then I would think: Why are you saying that about my country and my fellow citizens? And would you be hostile to me? These are natural, quite obvious questions. How do you think a Jew would feel at Glastonbury? People often DO associate citizens with their government - even from the past!

I was talking to a guy on holiday last month from Oman (who part owns Uber) and one of the first things he brought up was Britain as a coloniser. Er, what? I had to remind him that while Britain sought to abolish slavery, Oman kept it up until 1970. These fools don't know anything about history.

So why is "Death death to the IDF" a problem? Well it's a chant that stops just short of "Death death to the Jews". That would be too obvious, wouldn't it. The IDF is made up almost entirely of Jews.

We know antisemites use coded language like "Zionists", "Israeli government", "IDF" as euphemisms to attack Jews without openly saying it.

Have you ever heard the chant “Death to the IRGC” (Iran’s Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps), “Death to Hamas,” “Death to Assad’s army,” or “Death to the Russian military,” despite those groups committing well-documented atrocities? Again, the Jews get special treatment.

And calling death for a specific group encourages real life violence! We have already seen this play out.
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Does that logic extend to any other foreign government or military in the world? Is it Islamophobic to criticise Saudi Arabia’s dictatorship?

Is a criticism of the EU discriminatory to white Europeans?
 
steeleye20 said:
'In Gaza, we were the N*zis, they were like the jews'.

Harvard student, not welcomed back from his IDF service, but risking expulsion, for what he has said not what he did there, which probably involved blowing up innocent Palestinian women and children.

This type of shut-down also becoming normal in the UK under Count Von Starmer.

For him his aircraft being daubed is far more relevant than 50,000 souls being destroyed and his rotten administration being complicit in.

Supported by the media, police and the courts, now we can experience occupation ourselves (is it like the movies?).

If you are too close to the USA, then you are too close to the Israel lobby, who seem to be running the west anyway.

Over to Mossad BBC HQ, outraged at a chant but not a genocide.

😎
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Lol what a report. It doesn't get more biased than this nonsense
 
CPFCSaturn said:
Does that logic extend to any other foreign government or military in the world? Is it Islamophobic to criticise Saudi Arabia’s dictatorship?

Is a criticism of the EU discriminatory to white Europeans?
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Context is everything. The difference is the targeting of a specific group of people; the double standard and historical issues.

The trouble with ideology - especially the Marxist one you follow - is that it advocates a "one size fits all" yet life is nuanced so it doesn't work. So you can't just shoe horn into other examples easily like you are doing.
 
Penge Eagle said:
Context is everything. The difference is the targeting a specific group of people; the double standard and historical issues.

The trouble with ideology - especially the Marxist one you follow - is that it advocates a "one size fits all" yet life is nuanced so it doesn't work. So you can shoe horn into other examples easily like you are doing.
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Talking about Marxist ideology... you're really floundering 🤣

So seemingly your answer to my question is 'no, the logic doesn't extend to any other foreign government or military in the world' - it is a logic completely unique to Israel... the only government/military in the world who cannot be criticised.

And you actually think people will buy that utter guff?
 
CPFCSaturn said:
I mean you defend them, I don’t think it’s a verb that needs much of a definition?

You accept every explanation and justification released by the IDF and repeat them as fact, happily ignoring and dismissing all of the evidence to the contrary.
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I have stated multiple times that Israel will have made f*** ups like any country in war but especially with the challenges of urban warfare with lots of grey areas in terms of legality. However you have to be more specific about what you think I should or shouldn't defend about what's happened in the conflict. I cannot defend them for breaking the recent ceasefire. But I will defend them ahead of Islamic Jihadists all day long!
 
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