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Israel v Hamas

Stirlingsays said:
That clip seemed to have play issues for me but what I heard of it seemed pretty accurate.

It doesn't translate into flattening a city half of which is women and children but I didn't hear anything I disagreed with.
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(Because you couldn't watch it,) that's not the point he is making. He is talking about the goal of Islam in the region, mentioning recent historical examples and how it affects the tiny non-Muslim state there.
 
Penge Eagle said:
(Because you couldn't watch it,) that's not the point he is making. He is talking about the goal of Islam in the region, mentioning recent historical examples and how it affects the tiny non-Muslim state there.
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I heard that as it was at the start of the video but it froze on me later, nevertheless I have no issues with his description of Islam or their intent.

However, the state was put there in 47 and violently displaced 700,000 people, so obviously that initial contention would be pretty hard for them to accept.
 
Stirlingsays said:
I heard that as it was at the start of the video but it froze on me later, nevertheless I have no issues with his description of Islam or their intent.

However, the state was put there in 47 and violently displaced 700,000 people, so obviously that initial contention would be pretty hard for them to accept.
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Tough for them because the religion is intolerant of others. It's too late, Israel is going nowhere.
 
I watched this one and Louis has, for once, not been impartial and nailed his flag to the mast. It was very very biased and sad to see. He failed to ask any meaningful or pressing questions when speaking to the Arabs, but he was forthright with the Jews and sought out the most extreme he could find, he failed to acknowledge or recognise any of the points raised by the Jews. It was the most loaded investigation he's ever done and sad to see.

I am not saying the Jews are right on it all, but they are right on some things, and vice versa, but watching this you'd think the whole event was Jewish aggression, but worst of all was the total lack of interrogation concerning Oct 7 and the lack of enquiry about the obvious button pushing that the Arabs he was hanging around with were doing.
 
Spindle said:
I watched this one and Louis has, for once, not been impartial and nailed his flag to the mast. It was very very biased and sad to see. He failed to ask any meaningful or pressing questions when speaking to the Arabs, but he was forthright with the Jews and sought out the most extreme he could find, he failed to acknowledge or recognise any of the points raised by the Jews. It was the most loaded investigation he's ever done and sad to see.

I am not saying the Jews are right on it all, but they are right on some things, and vice versa, but watching this you'd think the whole event was Jewish aggression, but worst of all was the total lack of interrogation concerning Oct 7 and the lack of enquiry about the obvious button pushing that the Arabs he was hanging around with were doing.
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Genuine question; do you not think this speaks more to your own biases than Theroux's?

You seem to recognise he has a long track record of attempting to remain impartial in his journalism, but you think on this one occasion he just didn't bother..?
 
CPFCSaturn said:
Genuine question; do you not think this speaks more to your own biases than Theroux's?

You seem to recognise he has a long track record of attempting to remain impartial in his journalism, but you think on this one occasion he just didn't bother..?
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He has a track record of exposing extremists as long as they aren't muslim, except in this case he tars all of the Jews along with the extremists, which he doesn't do with all of the other extremists of all forms he's covered before. He went along with the Arab narrative because he wanted to, he poked the military in sensitive areas on purpose dressing it up as aggression, he failed to engage with any of the extremists from the Arab side and he failed to engage with the average Jewish Israeli to hear what they think.

I don't have biases on this at all. I have grown up seeing this conflict on the news since I was a child and it goes back and back and back. I recognise that there are bad actors on both sides and that the history is very very long. I have some Israeli friends and their views don't equate to what Theroux put out, at all.

The Arabs have been colonising other countries and taking over for hundreds of years, the Jews are the only people in the region to stand back and fight it. Maybe he can go to some of the Arab neighbours and ask them what they did with the Jews that used to live there.

I think he really let himself down with this one.
 
Spindle said:
He has a track record of exposing extremists as long as they aren't muslim, except in this case he tars all of the Jews along with the extremists, which he doesn't do with all of the other extremists of all forms he's covered before. He went along with the Arab narrative because he wanted to, he poked the military in sensitive areas on purpose dressing it up as aggression, he failed to engage with any of the extremists from the Arab side and he failed to engage with the average Jewish Israeli to hear what they think.

I don't have biases on this at all. I have grown up seeing this conflict on the news since I was a child and it goes back and back and back. I recognise that there are bad actors on both sides and that the history is very very long. I have some Israeli friends and their views don't equate to what Theroux put out, at all.

The Arabs have been colonising other countries and taking over for hundreds of years, the Jews are the only people in the region to stand back and fight it. Maybe he can go to some of the Arab neighbours and ask them what they did with the Jews that used to live there.

I think he really let himself down with this one.
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Everyone has biases - it's madness to suggest you don't. Your posts on this thread very much suggest you do. To be clear, I'm not claiming a high ground here - my point is that we all have biases.

I disagree with much of your assessment of the documentary, which was specifically about Israeli settlers. I don't agree Theroux 'went along' with any narrative - I think he put a camera in front of people who showed the world who they are and what they think, and he awkwardly nodded his way through it, as is his style.

You'd be absolutely right to say he could find similarly extreme views expressed by some Arabs, were he to make a documentary about Arab aggression in the region.
 
CPFCSaturn said:
Everyone has biases - it's madness to suggest you don't. Your posts on this thread very much suggest you do. To be clear, I'm not claiming a high ground here - my point is that we all have biases.

I disagree with much of your assessment of the documentary, which was specifically about Israeli settlers. I don't agree Theroux 'went along' with any narrative - I think he put a camera in front of people who showed the world who they are and what they think, and he awkwardly nodded his way through it, as is his style.

You'd be absolutely right to say he could find similarly extreme views expressed by some Arabs, were he to make a documentary about Arab aggression in the region.
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But he won't make one will he?

What bias do I have? Actually recognising that historical facts is not bias.
 
Spindle said:
But he won't make one will he?

What bias do I have? Actually recognising that historical facts is not bias.
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If you really believe you're a uniquely bias-proof person, I'm not sure there's much value in further discussion.

I've never come across that claim before - mental.
 
CPFCSaturn said:
Everyone has biases - it's madness to suggest you don't. Your posts on this thread very much suggest you do. To be clear, I'm not claiming a high ground here - my point is that we all have biases.

I disagree with much of your assessment of the documentary, which was specifically about Israeli settlers. I don't agree Theroux 'went along' with any narrative - I think he put a camera in front of people who showed the world who they are and what they think, and he awkwardly nodded his way through it, as is his style.

You'd be absolutely right to say he could find similarly extreme views expressed by some Arabs, were he to make a documentary about Arab aggression in the region.
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If you actually looked at the thread I posted, he (and his wife) is very anti Israel and should never have been involved in the programme.
 
Penge Eagle said:
If you actually looked at the thread I posted, he (and his wife) is very anti Israel and should never have been involved in the programme.
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I'll include some quotes from that thread:

"The word 'settler' is just a cheap way to dehumanize Jews living in their ancestral homeland."

"Nobody every explains why Jews shouldn't be allowed to live in Judea & Samaria"

"The entire 'settler violence' narrative is a manufactured hoax"

Forgive me if I don't take it too seriously as a source.
 
CPFCSaturn said:
If you really believe you're a uniquely bias-proof person, I'm not sure there's much value in further discussion.

I've never come across that claim before - mental.
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You're going to need to at least prove it in some way. What have I said that was biased?

Go back a few pages and you can read about my comments on Jewish terrorism, but I don't remember you saying I was biased then.

I was chastised on the BBS for saying that Gaza will get what is coming to it directly after Oct 7th, but I was simply pointing out that the IDF were going to smash the s*** out of the place in response. I said nothing about thinking that was fantastic.
 
CPFCSaturn said:
I'll include some quotes from that thread:

"The word 'settler' is just a cheap way to dehumanize Jews living in their ancestral homeland."

"Nobody every explains why Jews shouldn't be allowed to live in Judea & Samaria"

"The entire 'settler violence' narrative is a manufactured hoax"

Forgive me if I don't take it too seriously as a source.
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I was referring to what Louis Theroux and his wife has said and done.
 
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