Brighton - Tactics required

TheBigToePunt said:
As much as I'd like us to play as we did at Leeds, I'm beginning to question whether that particular performance was designed that way, or if it just happened.

If defending well in an organised shape was simply a tactical option, then surely Sage would have used it at Lyon?

I wondered if we defended better at Leeds because Tomiyasu played centrally rather than Disasi or Richards, but he came off at half time so that doesn't really explain it.

Perhaps it's that Leeds play much the same shape as us and we cancelled each other out? Perhaps they just didn't attack very well that particular day?

If we defend properly at Brighton then perhaps it is something Sage can do when he thinks it's for the best, but if not then the Leeds game will seem more and more like an anomaly.
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Post match Sage acknowledged that the players were too high up the field and that there was space between the lines leaving us vulnerable
This wasn't just against Lyons though; it's been a consistent theme this season other than perhaps v Leeds.
I assume Sage is conveying this message to the players in which case could there be a lack of leadership and organisation in the team on the field?
We don't have the most vociferous of teams e.g telling the wing backs to drop 20 yards when needed or one of the midfielders to stay if the other goes forward or telling Pino to cover the runner so Mitchell doesn't face a 2 on 1.
We must have one of the quietest teams since we've returned to the Premier League.
 
PatrickA said:
Post match Sage acknowledged that the players were too high up the field and that there was space between the lines leaving us vulnerable
This wasn't just against Lyons though; it's been a consistent theme this season other than perhaps v Leeds.
I assume Sage is conveying this message to the players in which case could there be a lack of leadership and organisation in the team on the field?
We don't have the most vociferous of teams e.g telling the wing backs to drop 20 yards when needed or one of the midfielders to stay if the other goes forward or telling Pino to cover the runner so Mitchell doesn't face a 2 on 1.
We must have one of the quietest teams since we've returned to the Premier League.
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Obviously we can't hear the players communicating (or not) but yet I know exactly what you mean. If I had to guess, I'd say our central defenders aren't natural talkers or organisers.

That said, even the most talkative players can only get others to implement the managers plan. Perhaps the Sage set up would work better with a more 'organising' type of player at the heart of defence, but I'm not so sure.
 
Brighton is one of the best playing teams in PL at the moment. We are leaking at the back and our main striker (JSL) is one of the less talented players in the league. Would like to see our Chilean guy on top, Lerma in defence and Wharton without the captain responsibility. If we can avoid goals against in the first 20 minutes, who knows....Unfortunately, their defender Striuk is allowed to play - he was always a problem for us playing Leeds. Come on, Eagles and chew those seagulls.
 
Willo said:
Brighton have been free-scoring and impressive this season.
A continuation of our recent performances will I suspect result in a comprehensive defeat and further questions raised as to appointment of Pierre Sage.
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Time to change the record, Willo. I, for one, am not going to call for Sage's head if we lose this afternoon. I'm sure I wo n't be alone in saying that.
 
doombear said:
Time to change the record, Willo. I, for one, am not going to call for Sage's head if we lose this afternoon. I'm sure I wo n't be alone in saying that.
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With respect I have not asserted that I will call for Sage's head if, as expected, we succumb to a defeat this afternoon.
In a plethora of conversions I have had with devotees, the 'Mood music' is that they have reservations about him and this was not in their mindset when Glasner was appointed.
They recognise, as I do, that Sage inherited a testing situation with key players departing or unavailable, the general 'Churn', and that the season is in its infancy, however some are simply not convinced that he is the man to meet such challenges.
I do hope the fears are allayed and Pierre Sage proves to be an inspired appointment.
 
TheBigToePunt said:
As much as I'd like us to play as we did at Leeds, I'm beginning to question whether that particular performance was designed that way, or if it just happened.

If defending well in an organised shape was simply a tactical option, then surely Sage would have used it at Lyon?

I wondered if we defended better at Leeds because Tomiyasu played centrally rather than Disasi or Richards, but he came off at half time so that doesn't really explain it.

Perhaps it's that Leeds play much the same shape as us and we cancelled each other out? Perhaps they just didn't attack very well that particular day?

If we defend properly at Brighton then perhaps it is something Sage can do when he thinks it's for the best, but if not then the Leeds game will seem more and more like an anomaly.
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Sadly I agree with you. Every game this season other than Leeds we have looked like we will concede a hatful of goals. In my opinion we will lose by a lot today. I have no faith in our setup :-( Yes, we might score a couple but those players going forward won’t get back in time to support our back three whoever they may be this time around. I just hope I’m wrong but after today Sage may be looking for a job?
 
I don't think people are suggesting that Sage could lose his job just because of a single heavy defeat by Brighton.
It would be more a case of a seeming inability to stem to incessant flow of goals conceded and an apparent lack of a plan to prevent said concession.

People have justifiably identified our better attacking and more fluid play under Sage, but there's little point in this if it's at the expense of our defensive capability.
There has to be a better balance and if Sage can't achieve this then it doesn't make one a miserabilist to point this out and suggest there can only be one conclusion.
 
PatrickA said:
I don't think people are suggesting that Sage could lose his job just because of a single heavy defeat by Brighton.
It would be more a case of a seeming inability to stem to incessant flow of goals conceded and an apparent lack of a plan to prevent said concession.

People have justifiably identified our better attacking and more fluid play under Sage, but there's little point in this if it's at the expense of our defensive capability.
There has to be a better balance and if Sage can't achieve this then it doesn't make one a miserabilist to point this out and suggest there can only be one conclusion.
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Not unless we can score more than the other team which we have done twice in the league so far and if Disaster had stayed on the pitch against Ipswich it might have been three times. I know we rode our luck, but at least the games are watchable and at least we are scoring, when we’re shipping goals AND not scoring then we can start to panic

It was always going to be tough losing Guehi, LaCroix and Munoz and sage is still trying to sort out what his best back three is…..if he’s got one😅
 
PatrickA said:
I don't think people are suggesting that Sage could lose his job just because of a single heavy defeat by Brighton.
It would be more a case of a seeming inability to stem to incessant flow of goals conceded and an apparent lack of a plan to prevent said concession.

People have justifiably identified our better attacking and more fluid play under Sage, but there's little point in this if it's at the expense of our defensive capability.
There has to be a better balance and if Sage can't achieve this then it doesn't make one a miserabilist to point this out and suggest there can only be one conclusion.
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Definitely shooting more, but the defence is a worry.
 
chris123 said:
Definitely shooting more, but the defence is a worry.
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We of course have lost Guehi, Lacroix and Munoz who at his best was an effective member of the defensive structure.
We purchased Tomiyasu who arrived on the back of significant injuries in recent seasons and of course is now unavailable. Riad has had his injury woes at our club and he too is back on the treatment table.Richards is more effective on the right than in the middle, Canvot is still learning his trade and is prone to error and Khalaili does not fill me with confidence from a defensive standpoint.Disasi has hardly impressed.
I recognise the challenges for Pierre Sage in organising a defensive unit, given our frailties in this area I would suggest that tactical adjustments will need to be made so they are not so exposed.
 
For me it's far, far too early to even talk in terms of changing the manager.

It is, however, far enough into Sage's time to identify what the areas of concern appear to be. We all seem to be seeing much the same things on that front, which itself is perhaps telling.

And I'm talking about tactics, by the way. In other words, the thing Sage is responsible for, not all the stuff that he isn't.
 
Willo said:
Brighton have been free-scoring and impressive this season.
A continuation of our recent performances will I suspect result in a comprehensive defeat and further questions raised as to appointment of Pierre Sage.
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Yawn.
Brighton have hammered most teams they’ve played so far this season.
How managers of opposing teams have been sacked thus far.
Must have missed Arteta getting the boot !
 
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