Australian beach terror attack.

Spindle said:
Actually it's irrelevant isn;t it. Do you think that they would announce if he was Christian or an atheist? No. POLITICAL BULLSHIT
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Correct.

The religion, beliefs or ethnicity of the Have a go Hero are irrelevant, he is simply a very brave hero.

The religion, beliefs or ethnicity of the suspects are relevant because they seem to underpin the motive and reason for the attack.
 
Phil’s Barber said:
Correct.

The religion, beliefs or ethnicity of the Have a go Hero are irrelevant, he is simply a very brave hero.

The religion, beliefs or ethnicity of the suspects are relevant because they seem to underpin the motive and reason for the attack.
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I don't really agree. I think it is important to understand that there are plenty of Muslims who just want to live their lives in peace and are appalled by this event, so I think it is helpful to note that another Muslim stepped in to save Jewish lives.

I would add however that there is clearly an appalling anti-semitism problem amongst a significant number of Muslims and also hard left wingers (certain behaviour at pro-Palestine marches and other public events has demonstrated that we are not just talking about a tiny number of hate-fuelled loonies). The point is that surely the answer is to try and engage better with the Muslims who just want to live their lives in peace, and aim to marginalise the anti-semites. Maybe this will prove impossible, but other options become even more difficult.
 
Living In Hope said:
I don't really agree. I think it is important to understand that there are plenty of Muslims who just want to live their lives in peace and are appalled by this event, so I think it is helpful to note that another Muslim stepped in to save Jewish lives.

I would add however that there is clearly an appalling anti-semitism problem amongst a significant number of Muslims and also hard left wingers (certain behaviour at pro-Palestine marches and other public events has demonstrated that we are not just talking about a tiny number of hate-fuelled loonies). The point is that surely the answer is to try and engage better with the Muslims who just want to live their lives in peace, and aim to marginalise the anti-semites. Maybe this will prove impossible, but other options become even more difficult.
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Totally delusional.

This will never happen. The meek don't call the shots. They never have and they never will. The fact that all Muslims are not homicidal killers is irrelevant.

People of violence only understand one language. There is absolutely no chance of overturning centuries of hate with kind words.
 
Hrolf The Ganger said:
Totally delusional.

This will never happen. The meek don't call the shots. They never have and they never will. The fact that all Muslims are not homicidal killers is irrelevant.

People of violence only understand one language. There is absolutely no chance of overturning centuries of hate with kind words.
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So the solution is ? To hold all Muslims accountable for these actions, alienate them all and ultimately try to drive them out of the West ? I knew that there would be comments like this, and I acknowledge my view may not work, but the alternative becomes unthinkable and surely a last resort. I still believe that the majority of people just want to live their lives and be tolerated by others, and we need to strive for that.
 
Living In Hope said:
So the solution is ? To hold all Muslims accountable for these actions, alienate them all and ultimately try to drive them out of the West ? I knew that there would be comments like this, and I acknowledge my view may not work, but the alternative becomes unthinkable and surely a last resort. I still believe that the majority of people just want to live their lives and be tolerated by others, and we need to strive for that.
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The majority of people just want to go to a beach without being shot, go to a Christmas market without being run over, get on a tube without being blown up, get on a plane without it flying into a building, go for a walk without hearing Allah akbar and being stabbed etc...

Edit: go to a concert without being blown up, go to a music festival without being shot, taken hostage and starved, raped etc...
 
Living In Hope said:
So the solution is ? To hold all Muslims accountable for these actions, alienate them all and ultimately try to drive them out of the West ? I knew that there would be comments like this, and I acknowledge my view may not work, but the alternative becomes unthinkable and surely a last resort. I still believe that the majority of people just want to live their lives and be tolerated by others, and we need to strive for that.
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The majority are not in charge.

Terrorists are in the West because we have allowed them in. Do you seriously believe that indoctrinated religious fanatics want to talk peace?

Our politicians are gutless self serving morons. They want to gaslight the population while our children are being raped and murdered and our culture replaced.
 
Hrolf The Ganger said:
The majority are not in charge.

Terrorists are in the West because we have allowed them in. Do you seriously believe that indoctrinated religious fanatics want to talk peace?

Our politicians are gutless self serving morons. They want to gaslight the population while our children are being raped and murdered and our culture replaced.
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No, I don't believe dialogue is possible with indoctrinated religious fanatics, and therefore dividing them from the rest of the Muslim population becomes incredibly important. Otherwise you badge 6.5% of our population (must be not far off 5m people) as enemies and extremists. That's not right either, and how do you deal with it anyway ? As per previous posts, what I am saying may not be possible, but surely better than the alternative, which feels like potential civil war, and therefore worth striving for, unless you have a better alternative.
 
Living In Hope said:
So the solution is ? To hold all Muslims accountable for these actions, alienate them all and ultimately try to drive them out of the West ? I knew that there would be comments like this, and I acknowledge my view may not work, but the alternative becomes unthinkable and surely a last resort. I still believe that the majority of people just want to live their lives and be tolerated by others, and we need to strive for that.
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How did you get to your age and not understand human nature?

Most people just want to live in peace? That's not how it works.

Take a look around at the state of the nation and how we got here.

Maybe you've lived far too comfortably in life.

People with your hippy crap have left a poisoned legacy for the next generation replete with poverty and conflict.

The road to hell is paved with hippy boomers.
 
Living In Hope said:
So the solution is ? To hold all Muslims accountable for these actions, alienate them all and ultimately try to drive them out of the West ? I knew that there would be comments like this, and I acknowledge my view may not work, but the alternative becomes unthinkable and surely a last resort. I still believe that the majority of people just want to live their lives and be tolerated by others, and we need to strive for that.
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There is no solution. The future is a Northern Ireland type situation with physical sectarian enclaves with mutual dislike and suspicion and periodic outbreaks of serious violence.
 
Stirlingsays said:
How did you get to your age and not understand human nature?

Most people just want to live in peace? That's not how it works.

Take a look around at the state of the nation and how we got here.

Maybe you've lived far too comfortably in life.

People with your hippy crap have left a poisoned legacy for the next generation replete with poverty and conflict.

The road to hell is paved with hippy boomers.
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That's quite an odd response to what I wrote. You haven't said what your solution is, nor has anyone else. Is it civil war ? Is that your immediate response to this ? Do you believe in collective responsibility for crimes so all Muslims must be held to account for a religious-motivated terror ?

I am neither a hippy nor a boomer, and I am interested in finding the best way forward from where we actually are, not where we would like to be. I have acknowledged multiple times that it might not work, but what is your plan, and that of others making similar comments. Please spell it out and others can judge whether they would try my way before leaping to yours.

And for the record I don't for a moment approve of how we have got here or allowed such a significant number of people into the country who have no alignment with what I believe British values are.
 
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