Where's the money gone?

[CrazyBadger]

"You have to speculate to accumulate", "You have to spend money to make money". These are sayings that the likes of Notts Forest live by.
yes, It's a gamble, but it's also more likely to yield quick results.

"Look after the Pennies, the Pounds will look after themselves" is more Palace. less risky.

It's a Tortoise and Hare scenario. The risk of being a Tortoise in the PL is being overtaken by too many Hares in one season.

 

[est1905]

"You have to speculate to accumulate", "You have to spend money to make money". These are sayings that the likes of Notts Forest live by.
yes, It's a gamble, but it's also more likely to yield quick results.

"Look after the Pennies, the Pounds will look after themselves" is more Palace. less risky.

It's a Tortoise and Hare scenario. The risk of being a Tortoise in the PL is being overtaken by too many Hares in one season.

Its not sexy to say this as its been said a thousand times but we have to be careful what we wish for. Back in 2010 before the last takeover went through all most of us wanted was a club to support that is on a firm financial footing. Yes time has moved on and yes winning the cup gives all of us a sense this could be a perfect time to kick on and break through that glass ceiling. If I were one of our board members I would be pushing to invest. To support Glasner with all he needs and see how far we can go. But I'll concede that its a good job I'm not on Palace's board because like it or not Parish is doing a great job.
Its easy to look at what Forest are spending and think we could be doing more but who is to say they dont fall foul of FFP? Or many of their big money signings flop? Even if that doesn't happen I still dont think Forest will necessarily break into the top 4 or win the EL.
With the resources we have its a slow build. We currently have in my opinion the best first 11 that we have ever had. Now we need to start building a top class bench which is harder when you are looking at players that might command a big salary and not play every week. We have to rely on free transfers if the wages are high or hope the next big star comes off the academy production line to supplement our squad. And thats another section of the club that costs a minimum of £5m a year to maintain. Our academy.

I agree its frustrating sometimes watching other clubs spend while we wonder what that player could have done for us but in reality? Unless we find ourselves taken over but a mega wealthy nutcase who is in a mad rush to win the Chamions League then this is our lane and from a stability point of view we need to stay in it.

 

[Palacesince64]

Its not sexy to say this as its been said a thousand times but we have to be careful what we wish for. Back in 2010 before the last takeover went through all most of us wanted was a club to support that is on a firm financial footing. Yes time has moved on and yes winning the cup gives all of us a sense this could be a perfect time to kick on and break through that glass ceiling. If I were one of our board members I would be pushing to invest. To support Glasner with all he needs and see how far we can go. But I'll concede that its a good job I'm not on Palace's board because like it or not Parish is doing a great job.
Its easy to look at what Forest are spending and think we could be doing more but who is to say they dont fall foul of FFP? Or many of their big money signings flop? Even if that doesn't happen I still dont think Forest will necessarily break into the top 4 or win the EL.
With the resources we have its a slow build. We currently have in my opinion the best first 11 that we have ever had. Now we need to start building a top class bench which is harder when you are looking at players that might command a big salary and not play every week. We have to rely on free transfers if the wages are high or hope the next big star comes off the academy production line to supplement our squad. And thats another section of the club that costs a minimum of £5m a year to maintain. Our academy.

I agree its frustrating sometimes watching other clubs spend while we wonder what that player could have done for us but in reality? Unless we find ourselves taken over but a mega wealthy nutcase who is in a mad rush to win the Chamions League then this is our lane and from a stability point of view we need to stay in it.

They’ve fallen foul before when they came up and bought all those players. Their chairman clearly knew they’d be docked points but figured the points benefit of having a better squad made it a risk worth taking. Looks like he’s decided to do it again for their European adventure.

 

[chris123]

Its not sexy to say this as its been said a thousand times but we have to be careful what we wish for. Back in 2010 before the last takeover went through all most of us wanted was a club to support that is on a firm financial footing. Yes time has moved on and yes winning the cup gives all of us a sense this could be a perfect time to kick on and break through that glass ceiling. If I were one of our board members I would be pushing to invest. To support Glasner with all he needs and see how far we can go. But I'll concede that its a good job I'm not on Palace's board because like it or not Parish is doing a great job.
Its easy to look at what Forest are spending and think we could be doing more but who is to say they dont fall foul of FFP? Or many of their big money signings flop? Even if that doesn't happen I still dont think Forest will necessarily break into the top 4 or win the EL.
With the resources we have its a slow build. We currently have in my opinion the best first 11 that we have ever had. Now we need to start building a top class bench which is harder when you are looking at players that might command a big salary and not play every week. We have to rely on free transfers if the wages are high or hope the next big star comes off the academy production line to supplement our squad. And thats another section of the club that costs a minimum of £5m a year to maintain. Our academy.

I agree its frustrating sometimes watching other clubs spend while we wonder what that player could have done for us but in reality? Unless we find ourselves taken over but a mega wealthy nutcase who is in a mad rush to win the Chamions League then this is our lane and from a stability point of view we need to stay in it.

We were 24hrs from liquidation

 

[Jim_Cannon]

They’ve fallen foul before when they came up and bought all those players. Their chairman clearly knew they’d be docked points but figured the points benefit of having a better squad made it a risk worth taking. Looks like he’s decided to do it again for their European adventure.

If Forest do fall foul again I expect the penalty would be much harsher and then fireworks will go. Given how they and some of their fans reacted to palace and Europe I would have no sympathy

 

[Eagleman13]

If Forest do fall foul again I expect the penalty would be much harsher and then fireworks will go. Given how they and some of their fans reacted to palace and Europe I would have no sympathy

Same as us, when they start in Europe, they will come under UEFA's FFP, which is far stricter the the FA's PSR, that's what Villa & Chelsea got fined for & now they are under a 3yr 'plan', whatever that is.

 

[Jim_Cannon]

Same as us, when they start in Europe, they will come under UEFA's FFP, which is far stricter the the FA's PSR, that's what Villa & Chelsea got fined for & now they are under a 3yr 'plan', whatever that is.

True. We look fine for uefa threshold of 70% wages/revenue as last accounts with circa 55%

 

[dreamwaverider]

The prize money is a few million, nothing to write home about in the grand scheme of things. We have a 100 million quid stand to build and PSR rules to comply with.

x2

 

[dreamwaverider]

I've highlighted that because in truth none of us understand the financial workings of the club.

The majority of the high net worth individuals that I dealt with in my career may have taken risks to accumulate their wealth, but once they have it they become more cautious. Our three American shareholders have investments in other sports enterprises. And American sports in particular, the amount of money turned over is vast.

Somebody on another thread posted our figures for the last two seasons. Those figures ( and I have no idea how accurate they are ) show that we are losing millions of pounds but given how PSR is calculated, we are considered to be well managed financially and have ' headroom ' to extend our debt by a further £90m before we would encounter any PSR issues.

I think you need to look at how we got to that point. It was through careful financial management as validated by those numbers. Some on here, very good at spending other people's money, are advocating the club uses that headroom. Never mind that the shareholders are already funding existing debt - which is not cheap. Never mind that there are plans to build a new stand ( yeah I know ).

Agreed, it would be nice to be seeing signings and you look at Forest and wonder how they do it. As Glasner said, don't believe all that you read in the papers. Although it's difficult, I ignore most of the clickbait links to players because they are just that - clickbait.

As for Eze, he needs to be sold this summer to appreciate something like his true value. This time next year he becomes another Marc Guehi - one season left on his deal - and then goes for either a reduced fee or walks for free at the end. I'm sure plenty of people would moan about that given the criticism of Guehi on here. You say Eze doesn't want to go - I'm not sure how you reach that conclusion because he hasn't indicated that nor have I seen that reported anywhere. Spurs will be a good fit under Frank and he will have Champions League football.

So if you drop $190 million into buying 43% of a company that any fool can see will need a further $100 million coming in just to stand still following its newly found success.
Please dont try telling me that none of our three multi billion dollar owners all with fantastic business CV's and wealth creation are not aware of the additional investment Palace needs to add further value?
It beggars belief.

 

[grumpymort]

Same as us, when they start in Europe, they will come under UEFA's FFP, which is far stricter the the FA's PSR, that's what Villa & Chelsea got fined for & now they are under a 3yr 'plan', whatever that is.

I disagree with it being stricter you get a fine that is it which is a joke and clubs like Chelsea know it which is why they don't care it's meaningless punishment for big clubs.

Rules should be if you can't meet requirements you are not allowed in but they wont ever do that because those big clubs have to much power we saw that with how they got away with not even receiving anymore punishment for trying the Super League.

Where has the money gone we don't have any people need to stop looking at owners worth it's meaningless. (We have allowed a lot of players to go on frees over the years which means 0 incoming from that side while we go spend Holding cost us 2m his wages was around 3m per year without buns fees and he has just gone on a free that is only 1 example)

Our problem is we need a new stadium but unfortunately SP is not good at this side of things and would rather choose to spend silly money on 1 stand which doesn't even add 10 thousand more. (He has always messed about with sort of things and other people had to force his hand AP/Big Sam for the training/data side of things a Tex pushed through Academy)

 

[dreamwaverider]

I am hoping the reason we are selling Eze is based more on future planning than finances.
If we bring in El Khanoouus and Dibling as a result, then it will start to make sense from a financial standpoint.
Only time will tell. We secured our best ever manager last year. Maybe we have got plans no one else can see.

 

[est1905]

We were 24hrs from liquidation

Yes we were. Your point?

 

[grumpymort]

I am hoping the reason we are selling Eze is based more on future planning than finances.
If we bring in El Khanoouus and Dibling as a result, then it will start to make sense from a financial standpoint.
Only time will tell. We secured our best ever manager last year. Maybe we have got plans no one else can see.

I can't see us getting Dibling as well others had put offers in for him and they had been rejected.

We would need to pay out something silly like 40m+

Eze money isn't that big 60m and 15-20% goes to QPR

 

[JHB]

So if you drop $190 million into buying 43% of a company that any fool can see will need a further $100 million coming in just to stand still following its newly found success.
Please dont try telling me that none of our three multi billion dollar owners all with fantastic business CV's and wealth creation are not aware of the additional investment Palace needs to add further value?
It beggars belief.

Of course they are aware but they are also aware that if the value of the EPL increases then the value of Palace does as well. The way to look at it is that they’ve bought a share in the value of the EPL through the Palace ownership. If viewed like that then as long as Palace are a stable EPL club why invest more?

 

[Rudi Hedman]

Of course they are aware but they are also aware that if the value of the EPL increases then the value of Palace does as well. The way to look at it is that they’ve bought a share in the value of the EPL through the Palace ownership. If viewed like that then as long as Palace are a stable EPL club why invest more?

Why invest more in the stadium? Because the club will be worth even more!

 

[Painter]

So if you drop $190 million into buying 43% of a company that any fool can see will need a further $100 million coming in just to stand still following its newly found success.
Please dont try telling me that none of our three multi billion dollar owners all with fantastic business CV's and wealth creation are not aware of the additional investment Palace needs to add further value?
It beggars belief.

They are multi billionaires for a good reason, they know what they are doing regarding investments.

 

[see_change]

1 ) Those Billions of dollars of money they are worth aren't sitting in a bank account waiting for Steve to ring up and say " mate can you transfer me 40 so I can buy Tyler " . That's the Value of the companies they own.

They CAN spend money on the new Stand from money outside revenue , but ( Correct me if I'm wrong ) Ingoings / Outgoings have to be funded out of revenue , though some borrowing is allowed .

2) Strict guidelines of what they can do and Parish has been observing those so we don't get into trouble .

So much as we'd like them to , the Owners can't just transfer into 200 mill even if they wanted to . Well they could but we'd be breaching fair play etc ....

Personally I have. no problems with how SP is managing our finances

 

[Ex Dubai Eagle]

True. We look fine for uefa threshold of 70% wages/revenue as last accounts with circa 55%

Absolutely, it wasn't that long ago (just before Pat Viera) when we had just about the oldest first team in the PL, with most of those players having little or no sell on value & wages were running at something like 78% of turnover, which of course was completely unsustainable, so to now be where we are could only have been achieved by implementing a strong sensible financial management structure & sticking to it.

 

[Ex Dubai Eagle]

1 ) Those Billions of dollars of money they are worth aren't sitting in a bank account waiting for Steve to ring up and say " mate can you transfer me 40 so I can buy Tyler " . That's the Value of the companies they own.

They CAN spend money on the new Stand from money outside revenue , but ( Correct me if I'm wrong ) Ingoings / Outgoings have to be funded out of revenue , though some borrowing is allowed .

2) Strict guidelines of what they can do and Parish has been observing those so we don't get into trouble .

So much as we'd like them to , the Owners can't just transfer into 200 mill even if they wanted to . Well they could but we'd be breaching fair play etc ....

Personally I have. no problems with how SP is managing our finances

What you can say is that now several overspend cases have been heard & ruled on with Forest & Everton receiving points deductions (assuming the financial goalposts havent moved) is that -
to overspend by £10 million = points deduction of ...........
to overspend by £30 million = points deduction of............
etc -

so you could choose to play the game, buy that special extra player(s) hoping that the inclusion(s) in the team will bring more points than the deduction penalty or be the difference between relegation & safety.

Maybe Forest are doing this or something similar ?

 

[madcap_v2]

I can't see us getting Dibling as well others had put offers in for him and they had been rejected.

We would need to pay out something silly like 40m+

Eze money isn't that big 60m and 15-20% goes to QPR

15-20% of the profits of the sale goes to QPR