US Politics

[DanH]

It's my fault for going off topic, but I have to respond to such a daft post...

Nobody is denying the impact Moses, Wan-Bissaka and Zaha have made at the club – Zaha should probably have a statue built outside the ground one day. But every football club has black players – even the s*** ones! The Premier League is a global league so its clubs have foreign players combined youth from their catchment area. How are Palace any different?

The idea that South London players are unique to Palace is for the birds as they've contributed to other teams. Arsenal's Smith Rowe, Maitland-Niles, Nelson, Nketiah and Chelsea's Loftus-Cheek, Hudson-Odoi, Chalobah, Abraham, Guehi are some recent examples.

Statements like: "Where we are now as a club is in no small part to the multiculturalism of south London" also erases nearly a century of history that predates recent immigration trends. Palace were founded in 1905 and survived two world wars, financial ruin, relocations, and relegations long before modern multicultural South London took shape. And you've obviously never heard of the incredible young talent from the 'Team of the 80s'.

Yep but we’re having the most sustained successful period the club has ever had and won our first ever trophy thanks in no small part to the reasons in my ‘daft’ post.

 

[silvertop]

I'm not remotely offended, I just think it's mental.

Posters ganging up on one to support another asserting another can fight his own battles.

Irony?

 

[Penge Eagle]

Yep but we’re having the most sustained successful period the club has ever had and won our first ever trophy thanks in no small part to the reasons in my ‘daft’ post.

It wasn't that long ago we almost dropped into the third tier of English football (twice). That could have been the start of a very unsuccessful period in the club's long history. Was that down to South London's ethnic make-up? It's irrelevant. So yes, it is a daft post.

 

[georgenorman]

Yep but we’re having the most sustained successful period the club has ever had and won our first ever trophy thanks in no small part to the reasons in my ‘daft’ post.

Personally, I think it is one of the understated benefits of Brexit.

 

[eaglesdare]

Again there is nothing wrong with immigrants coming over and being a credit to society and giving back to the community, working paying taxes etc.. as seen with likes of Zaha, Eze, Moses.

I myself have been an immigrant numerous times. I worked, paid my taxes and never had any freebies given to me. Oh and I also didn't commit any crimes.

I guess the looney lefties don't know the difference between legal and illegal immigration either.

 

[georgenorman]

Again there is nothing wrong with immigrants coming over and being a credit to society and giving back to the community, working paying taxes etc.. as seen with likes of Zaha, Eze, Moses.

I myself have been an immigrant numerous times. I worked, paid my taxes and never had any freebies given to me. Oh and I also didn't commit any crimes.

I guess the looney lefties don't know the difference between legal and illegal immigration either.

Paying less tax and them spending the money themselves would benefit the economy and 'the community' (whatever that is) more.

 

[Rudi Hedman]

Well given that ad revenue drives sites like this I’d suggest you should care if posters are being driven away.

This is a fan site representing one of the most multicultural clubs in one of the most multicultural parts of the country. It should be as welcoming as possible, not a safe haven for the hard right who chase away anyone that disagrees with them.

Sounds like a clampdown on free speech to me. Try doing that on the terraces.

 

[DanH]

Personally, I think it is one of the understated benefits of Brexit.

You got a smile out of me, George.

 

[Rudi Hedman]

Where we are now as a club is in no small part to the multiculturalism of south London.

Can you please explain this?

The club have released data and heat maps of members’ residency. This was several years ago and I’d bet the trend has continued. You know, fans have moved out of nearby areas and travel in on match day, so how has multiculturalism been a part of our progress?

And there are very few non white fans at Palace or other clubs that don’t or haven’t won regular silverware. This observation won’t be true at Arsenal however. Their crowd is very ethnically diverse. You will see far more black men in Arsenal shirts than Palace shirts near Selhurst. Many more. 99% more.

If you’re going to talk about players ethnicity then this isn’t a reason. Before immigration all clubs had British isles players. Then all clubs had a few black players who originated from the Caribbean. Then all clubs had a few European players. Then all clubs had quite a few more European players and quite a few African players. The people living in the areas around Selhurst having nothing to do with this.

 

[Penge Eagle]

Sounds like a clampdown on free speech to me. Try doing that on the terraces.

Of course it is. He doesn't like that people have different political opinions so he makes up lies and conspiracy theories to defend his quest for censorship. We've seen it all before.

 

[Rudi Hedman]

Yep but we’re having the most sustained successful period the club has ever had and won our first ever trophy thanks in no small part to the reasons in my ‘daft’ post.

Our progress is down to:

Parish getting the deal he wanted out of administration.

The original 4 owners.

Parish.

Pulis’s miracle. Yes, that.

Parish bringing in investors.

The Allardyce transfer window financed by Harris & Blitzer.

Hodgson accepting the lack of funds.

Bringing in Textor for transfer funds again.

Textor recommending Glasner.

Parish sticking with Glasner.

 

[ASCPFC]

It wasn't that long ago we almost dropped into the third tier of English football (twice). That could have been the start of a very unsuccessful period in the club's long history. Was that down to South London's ethnic make-up? It's irrelevant. So yes, it is a daft post.

If I want to say a couple of uncomfortable truths about Palace - in the US politics section - Firstly: these days I'm surprised we sign any white players. It feels like the team are largely African in descent and Christian - almost quite fundamentalist. Feels Baptist or Seventh Day Adventist or something. It's not a big deal to me. I'm white but I feel like black represents the area these days. I expect others feel it too.

Then I look at the crowd. Many definitely travel in. If I were to take a straw poll I guess I would find most come from the area (otherwise it's a bit tenuous to follow Palace). I'm from Bromley. I left there in the 80s. I find most fans I speak to are the same. They're from Bromley or Croydon but don't live there any more. I don't ask why. It's not necessarily pertinent. Could be jobs,house prices, better standard of living. I'm the same - I live in Ireland now.

Demographics of the fans. Over the years I noticed at least 90 something percent of our fans would be white. I have noticed an increase in people of colour recently. But it still would not be 10 percent of our fanbase. So our fans aren't really representing the area - why is this? Well I guess we all left. Obviously there are still locals but it's certainly not a huge contingent. The home counties are more likely to have our fans in my opinion. Kent, Sussex etc.

I will say as above: I see more black and Asian supporters all the time. And I think that's good. I think to myself - at least we're getting some of the new locals now.

One of the main questions here is "would I go back?". No I bloody wouldn't. The area would not represent me, my family or my interests any more. Only Palace. Palace are the sole reason I go to London.

I don't feel unsafe in Croydon. I'm not really someone like that. But I don't feel I fit in, even though I come from there. Obviously it is rough. I've seen a stabbing. I don't particularly mind. But would I put the wife and kids through that? Why would I?

The area is not mine anymore. It's not white British frankly. The team isn't either. But I do think the team represents the best side of the area currently. But anyone suggesting that Croydon was not miles nicer in the past is deluded. It's crazy how s*** it is now. As is most of South London.

Anybody going to say why Croydon/ South London is so bad for crime now? Anyone going to say why the riots happened? Why can't I have my phone out? Why do I need to put money in my sock and not go to bank machines?
Could a general answer be multi culturalism? I'm totally off topic but the Palace discussion needed a bit of context here I felt.

 

[Penge Eagle]

Dan's logic is that Palace fans with conservative views are not allowed to like a conservative US president because Selhurst Park is in an ethnically diverse location and some ethnic players have performed well for the club in recent history. It's totally brain-dead.

 

[eaglesdare]

Dan's logic is that Palace fans with conservative views are not allowed to like a conservative US president because Selhurst Park is in an ethnically diverse location and some ethnic players have performed well for the club in recent history. It's totally brain-dead.

Trump's own mother was an immigrant aswell 🤷🏻‍♂️

 

[eaglesdare]

If I want to say a couple of uncomfortable truths about Palace - in the US politics section - Firstly: these days I'm surprised we sign any white players. It feels like the team are largely African in descent and Christian - almost quite fundamentalist. Feels Baptist or Seventh Day Adventist or something. It's not a big deal to me. I'm white but I feel like black represents the area these days. I expect others feel it too.

Then I look at the crowd. Many definitely travel in. If I were to take a straw poll I guess I would find most come from the area (otherwise it's a bit tenuous to follow Palace). I'm from Bromley. I left there in the 80s. I find most fans I speak to are the same. They're from Bromley or Croydon but don't live there any more. I don't ask why. It's not necessarily pertinent. Could be jobs,house prices, better standard of living. I'm the same - I live in Ireland now.

Demographics of the fans. Over the years I noticed at least 90 something percent of our fans would be white. I have noticed an increase in people of colour recently. But it still would not be 10 percent of our fanbase. So our fans aren't really representing the area - why is this? Well I guess we all left. Obviously there are still locals but it's certainly not a huge contingent. The home counties are more likely to have our fans in my opinion. Kent, Sussex etc.

I will say as above: I see more black and Asian supporters all the time. And I think that's good. I think to myself - at least we're getting some of the new locals now.

One of the main questions here is "would I go back?". No I bloody wouldn't. The area would not represent me, my family or my interests any more. Only Palace. Palace are the sole reason I go to London.

I don't feel unsafe in Croydon. I'm not really someone like that. But I don't feel I fit in, even though I come from there. Obviously it is rough. I've seen a stabbing. I don't particularly mind. But would I put the wife and kids through that? Why would I?

The area is not mine anymore. It's not white British frankly. The team isn't either. But I do think the team represents the best side of the area currently. But anyone suggesting that Croydon was not miles nicer in the past is deluded. It's crazy how s*** it is now. As is most of South London.

Anybody going to say why Croydon/ South London is so bad for crime now? Anyone going to say why the riots happened? Why can't I have my phone out? Why do I need to put money in my sock and not go to bank machines?
Could a general answer be multi culturalism? I'm totally off topic but the Palace discussion needed a bit of context here I felt.

There was a picture a few years ago of all the players celebrating after a game in front of the away fans. All black players and all white fans. I'll try find it if I can.

 

[Rudi Hedman]

If I want to say a couple of uncomfortable truths about Palace - in the US politics section - Firstly: these days I'm surprised we sign any white players. It feels like the team are largely African in descent and Christian - almost quite fundamentalist. Feels Baptist or Seventh Day Adventist or something. It's not a big deal to me. I'm white but I feel like black represents the area these days. I expect others feel it too.

Then I look at the crowd. Many definitely travel in. If I were to take a straw poll I guess I would find most come from the area (otherwise it's a bit tenuous to follow Palace). I'm from Bromley. I left there in the 80s. I find most fans I speak to are the same. They're from Bromley or Croydon but don't live there any more. I don't ask why. It's not necessarily pertinent. Could be jobs,house prices, better standard of living. I'm the same - I live in Ireland now.

Demographics of the fans. Over the years I noticed at least 90 something percent of our fans would be white. I have noticed an increase in people of colour recently. But it still would not be 10 percent of our fanbase. So our fans aren't really representing the area - why is this? Well I guess we all left. Obviously there are still locals but it's certainly not a huge contingent. The home counties are more likely to have our fans in my opinion. Kent, Sussex etc.

I will say as above: I see more black and Asian supporters all the time. And I think that's good. I think to myself - at least we're getting some of the new locals now.

One of the main questions here is "would I go back?". No I bloody wouldn't. The area would not represent me, my family or my interests any more. Only Palace. Palace are the sole reason I go to London.

I don't feel unsafe in Croydon. I'm not really someone like that. But I don't feel I fit in, even though I come from there. Obviously it is rough. I've seen a stabbing. I don't particularly mind. But would I put the wife and kids through that? Why would I?

The area is not mine anymore. It's not white British frankly. The team isn't either. But I do think the team represents the best side of the area currently. But anyone suggesting that Croydon was not miles nicer in the past is deluded. It's crazy how s*** it is now. As is most of South London.

Anybody going to say why Croydon/ South London is so bad for crime now? Anyone going to say why the riots happened? Why can't I have my phone out? Why do I need to put money in my sock and not go to bank machines?
Could a general answer be multi culturalism? I'm totally off topic but the Palace discussion needed a bit of context here I felt.

Sure there are few more black fans recently. I noticed this in the ground after the shambolic bus parade because of milling around more. They had palace shirts on and knew the songs so definitely 1st club fans and hopefully not Arsenal first and Palace 2nd.

But the reasons ethnic minorities in large numbers don’t tend to support Palace and clubs that haven’t won silverware for that matter has been discussed before.

They don’t have a historical connection to the area. And Dad or uncle doesn’t support them so doesn’t take them. Aren’t successful so what is the point and/or friends at school feel the same. It is seen as a waste of money anyway and more so because of the above reasons.

Arsenal have a lot of ethnic minority fans all over London and in the stadium, because of their success. Chelsea have a few but I wonder why considering their away fans. The home experience is apparently different so perhaps why, and being a tv fan is different to the reality.

 

[Rudi Hedman]

There was a picture a few years ago of all the players celebrating after a game in front of the away fans. All black players and all white fans. I'll try find it if I can.

It’s a sign of the times or the trends in professional football transfers and contracts. Zero to do with the local area.

We get behind all our players unless they aren’t professional.

 

[DanH]

Of course it is. He doesn't like that people have different political opinions so he makes up lies and conspiracy theories to defend his quest for censorship. We've seen it all before.

So telling me to leave the site wasn’t trying to shut down my free speech?

 

[Penge Eagle]

So telling me to leave the site wasn’t trying to shut down my free speech?

Let me explain it in a different way. It's a free market, so if you don't like the website you have the freedom to go elsewhere. It's very simple.

 

[Rudi Hedman]

There is, because otherwise our team would be ‘monocultural’ because all the best players in the area would be ‘monocultural’ (why you lot are so scared of just saying white I’ll never know).

Literally how meritocracy works.

The fact is that the premier league is now a league of players from around the world. Man City, Liverpool, Man Utd etc can afford the best. They have an ethnic mix of players.

The further down the division you go the more you have to get the most from your money with bargains. This might be very good African players or more likely now hidden gems or diamonds in the rough from European clubs who’ve given them their apprenticeship if you like. They may have picked them up from anywhere. That part isn’t relevant.

It’s certainly true that we have a lot of black players in the academy years, and it is true that population figures account for this. Wharton and Devenney are white and come from clubs and areas that don’t have a large black population.

There are talented white and black players in the world and that worldwide talent level isn’t explained in the academy of CPFC. How many countries with teams completely white now win tournaments apart from Argentina? None. How many completely black international teams win tournaments outside of Africa? None.