War in Ukraine

Stirlingsays said:
Sounds like playing nice during negotiations behind the scenes.

Would be surprised, if very pleased if Russia/Ukraine stopped this summer.

But you never know what's being worked on.

Fingers crossed.
Click to expand...
I was more thinking it lifts the possibility of any sanctions on any other teams. I doubt this is for Russia's sake - although cash will have changed hands some where. It always does.
 
silvertop said:
Doubt it. Putin will double down. It is in his nature and I am not sure he has much choice.
Click to expand...

While Russia have been making steady progress Ukraine have been reserving troops and some think there's a possibility of a Ukraine offensive this summer, it could be that this war might last beyond the year....which would be in American and Europe's interest....if not the people of Ukraine or Russia (though Zelensky and co probably don't want the war to stop because that also means the money tap stops).

Putin isn't far away from taking the Donbas.....I think Russia going beyond that is unlikely. It will take Russia a long time, maybe decades to recover from the war.....though their energy supplies mean they will recover.

Ukraine.....Well, I the country will be changed beyond all recognition and I think that's going to be a very unstable and dangerous place after the war. A kind of European version of Libya or Syria.....That is unless the Europeans are prepared to stablise the country with troops, which would be difficult but possible within a negotiated settlement if people are prepared to realistically give and take......Not something we have seen thus far.

Obviously I regard the whole situation as the result of disastrous decision making from decades ago.....but we are where we are. Millions of people get to suffer and die out of elite negligence and hubris.
 
Stirlingsays said:
While Russia have been making steady progress Ukraine have been reserving troops and some think there's a possibility of a Ukraine offensive this summer, it could be that this war might last beyond the year....which would be in American and Europe's interest....if not the people of Ukraine or Russia (though Zelensky and co probably don't want the war to stop because that also means the money tap stops).

Putin isn't far away from taking the Donbas.....I think Russia going beyond that is unlikely. It will take Russia a long time, maybe decades to recover from the war.....though their energy supplies mean they will recover.

Ukraine.....Well, I the country will be changed beyond all recognition and I think that's going to be a very unstable and dangerous place after the war. A kind of European version of Libya or Syria.....That is unless the Europeans are prepared to stablise the country with troops, which would be difficult but possible within a negotiated settlement if people are prepared to realistically give and take......Not something we have seen thus far.

Obviously I regard the whole situation as the result of disastrous decision making from decades ago.....but we are where we are. Millions of people get to suffer and die out of elite negligence and hubris.
Click to expand...
If it makes you feel a tiny bit better, Putin may agree this under extreme protest, but he would rather fight on than agree those troops being British.

It is bad enough having us on his Baltic border.
 
DanH said:
So capitulating to what he’s always wanted?
Click to expand...

Well you could always be out there in a trench.

This situation was always the most likely outcome.

Intelligent leaders would have taken the 2022 terms.

Millions of people have suffered and hundreds of thousands have died due to the chest out virtue signalling of people who wouldn't go fight.....rather than negotiating realism.

An horrendous outcome has been covered up with virtue signalling......Never have I read such memory holed rubbish than what has been written about this war....especially early on.....endless talking heads on media presented as experts stating absolute rot that was proven wrong by events.

Has there ever been a war more lied about than this one?

Come to think about it.....probably.
 
Stirlingsays said:
Well you could always be out there in a trench.

This situation was always the most likely outcome.

Intelligent leaders would have taken the 2022 terms.

Millions of people have suffered and hundreds of thousands have died due to the chest out virtue signalling of people who wouldn't go fight.....rather than negotiating realism.

An horrendous outcome has been covered up with virtue signalling......Never have I read such memory holed rubbish than what has been written about this war....especially early on.....endless talking heads on media presented as experts stating absolute rot that was proven wrong by events.

Has there ever been a war more lied about than this one?

Come to think about it.....probably.
Click to expand...
Vitamen
 
Last edited:
Stirlingsays said:
Well you could always be out there in a trench.

This situation was always the most likely outcome.

Intelligent leaders would have taken the 2022 terms.

Millions of people have suffered and hundreds of thousands have died due to the chest out virtue signalling of people who wouldn't go fight.....rather than negotiating realism.

An horrendous outcome has been covered up with virtue signalling......Never have I read such memory holed rubbish than what has been written about this war....especially early on.....endless talking heads on media presented as experts stating absolute rot that was proven wrong by events.

Has there ever been a war more lied about than this one?

Come to think about it.....probably.
Click to expand...
If that deal is now struck...

A rotten deal for Russia, but Putin can sell it to his people as success which, in some ways, it is. He has "liberated" the Russian sector and created a defensive buffer on his western border.

For Ukraine it would be a humiliation and one hard to sell. Greater security, perhaps, as Putin would not dare come back for more.

For the West, almost total success. Return to normal trading, a seasoned domestic military better adapted to modern warfare (without the loss of a man) and an adversary back in its box for generations.
 
silvertop said:
If that deal is now struck...

A rotten deal for Russia, but Putin can sell it to his people as success which, in some ways, it is. He has "liberated" the Russian sector and created a defensive buffer on his western border.

For Ukraine it would be a humiliation and one hard to sell. Greater security, perhaps, as Putin would not dare come back for more.

For the West, almost total success. Return to normal trading, a seasoned domestic military better adapted to modern warfare (without the loss of a man) and an adversary back in its box for generations.
Click to expand...

I would like that.

But as Russia said at the time it was a one time offer.

Now they want a buffer zone that extends further out.

I don't think Ukraine can ever really accept that and I don't blame them for it.

But it's where we are and why the whole thing is an almighty sh1t show.

Like in Iran we can only hope for sanity but expect elitist hubris and escalation.

You would think that history would teach people what is required to actually win major wars...it isn't pretty and is very expensive in both human and economic terms.....but alas as Einstein never said, 'two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe.'
 
McAhuna said:
Do you walk the walk?
Or just talk the talk?

Azov International Battalion

It won't all be fighting in a trench. You'll get to preach politics around the campfire in the evenings. You'll love it, and I've no doubt these guys will give you a warm welcome.
Click to expand...

Dan is too busy heroically fighting us bullies on the Hol.

Let's hope he's getting plenty of applause in his DMs from his admirers for his bravery.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page

Holmesdale Online Shop

Back
Top