Censorship and Social Media

So the youth are indoctrinated! And you aren’t, I suppose!

We all get influenced by those we trust but I see less in the young than others. The young take pride in their independence! Getting them out to vote has always been a problem but keeping Farage’s hands off the levers of power is the strongest motivation for them I can recall.

You don’t speak for “the people”. You speak for an echo chamber and you only fool yourself, and them, with your silly assertions.

The kind of “retribution” attitude you espouse, reminiscent of Trump, is another strong motive to make sure the ideas of people like you never see power. We know there are problems. We know why there are problems. Those problems aren’t caused by social liberalism. They have been caused by events. Social liberalism is the cure, not the disease. Blaming scapegoats is what the weak minded, without any real ideas or answers, do.

The government, with its announcement of compulsory training for young people not in education or employment, the “NEETS”, may well have turned the tide in its fortunes. It’s brave, expensive and full of difficulties but is also very necessary.

I no more “crave” foreigners than I do cigarettes! I see the need for us to accept some current immigration. If we can get the skills we need locally then no problem. Nor do I hate benefits. Some are necessary. What I believe is that most people can, and should, do something, whether or not they receive support. It’s the feckless who I detest. Those who play the system because they are lazy.
You have to ask why Trump and Farage and Le Pen etc are popular. They wouldn’t exist as political forces if the authorities didn’t cock everything up. I would question where the alternatives on the left exist in similar levels of support. Corbyn, Galloway are figureheads of the far left but don’t seem to be popular, perhaps because it is the left who appear to be in control; hence the popularity of the right as the counter.
You may not like it but it is going to be Farage’s turn to rectify the situation.
 
You have to ask why Trump and Farage and Le Pen etc are popular. They wouldn’t exist as political forces if the authorities didn’t cock everything up. I would question where the alternatives on the left exist in similar levels of support. Corbyn, Galloway are figureheads of the far left but don’t seem to be popular, perhaps because it is the left who appear to be in control; hence the popularity of the right as the counter.
You may not like it but it is going to be Farage’s turn to rectify the situation.
Immigration, crime, lack of housing, anti social behaviour and lack of services all exacerbated due to immigration. Despite being told otherwise. Immigration has given rise to the right. It could have quite easily been avoided. The tactic of blackening the name of the right is also wearing very thin. Hence sound bites from the left about immigration now - as they try to hold onto their jobs.
 
So the youth are indoctrinated! And you aren’t, I suppose!

Well, that's a whole other question as to how any of us end up into what we are politically.

However, it's certainly true that I was indoctrinated into liberalism and it took growing up and learning about life to even change into becoming a conservative........Then when you realise you're a social conservative you realise that modern day conservativism is socially liberal and voted in work laws and thus we end up voting Reform.....The leading party in the country (which you were wrong about after the election).

We all get influenced by those we trust but I see less in the young than others. The young take pride in their independence! Getting them out to vote has always been a problem but keeping Farage’s hands off the levers of power is the strongest motivation for them I can recall.

Yeah, no principles, you only care about power.

I said that to you years ago and you denied it at the time.....Yet as we see so many times you are quite happy to contradict yourself later.

The establishment have utterly failed and they are scared stiff of Farage because he's going to sack a lot of them (richly deserved) so they like you.....zero principles.


But ultimately, it ain't going to work mate.

Market forces, simple as.

You don’t speak for “the people”. You speak for an echo chamber and you only fool yourself, and them, with your silly assertions.

I refer you to the national polls.

That shows you speak for practically hardly anyone.

The kind of “retribution” attitude you espouse, reminiscent of Trump, is another strong motive to make sure the ideas of people like you never see power. We know there are problems. We know why there are problems. Those problems aren’t caused by social liberalism. They have been caused by events. Social liberalism is the cure, not the disease. Blaming scapegoats is what the weak minded, without any real ideas or answers, do.

Pure denialism.

Doesn't matter, you are of the past and there's nothing you can do about it.

The government, with its announcement of compulsory training for young people not in education or employment, the “NEETS”, may well have turned the tide in its fortunes. It’s brave, expensive and full of difficulties but is also very necessary.

I like the fact that this gives you hope.

I won't chuckle, but I admit it's hard not to.

I no more “crave” foreigners than I do cigarettes! I see the need for us to accept some current immigration. If we can get the skills we need locally then no problem. Nor do I hate benefits. Some are necessary. What I believe is that most people can, and should, do something, whether or not they receive support. It’s the feckless who I detest. Those who play the system because they are lazy.

Well, if you don't like the feckless, that should have made you pretty much against the majority of immigration from the last thirty years.

But you are literally a third worldist, yet that's the immigration that pulls the highest benefits.....Non European migrants cost the state more than European ones.

Your politics contradicts itself at every turn.
 
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You have to ask why Trump and Farage and Le Pen etc are popular. They wouldn’t exist as political forces if the authorities didn’t cock everything up. I would question where the alternatives on the left exist in similar levels of support. Corbyn, Galloway are figureheads of the far left but don’t seem to be popular, perhaps because it is the left who appear to be in control; hence the popularity of the right as the counter.
You may not like it but it is going to be Farage’s turn to rectify the situation.
It’s not necessary to ask why the far right have had a surge in popularity. It’s obvious. There have been a series of events that no government, of any stripe, could neither have avoided nor been unaffected by. The consequences have been equally obvious, unwelcome and unavoidable. When that happens it’s the current politicians who get the blame and those on the sidelines, without any responsibility and just making promises, who reap the benefit.

This isn’t new. The unseen green grass in the next field always being better than the one you are in is a well worn phenomenon. In many ways it’s part of our evolution. The willingness to try new things, only this isn’t new. It’s been tried before. Lest we forget!

Hopefully we won’t forget. We will certainly be reminded as I anticipate an amalgam of the great and the good, from all walks of life and political spectrums doing so. There will always be the political opportunists willing to sacrifice their country’s interests in order to share power by doing deals with the devil, but I don’t sense there are too many.

So don’t rule out a grand coalition. A national government formed to ensure the UK remains free of the kind of politics we are witnessing in the USA.

The Labour Party are actually doing some very wise, progressive, bold and necessary things at present. Things that when better understood could easily reverse the trends. Speeding up the trial process, requiring NEETs to accept training, negotiating with the EU for the ECHR to reform the way the Court interprets the rights of migrants not entitled to be here, etc.
 
Immigration, crime, lack of housing, anti social behaviour and lack of services all exacerbated due to immigration. Despite being told otherwise. Immigration has given rise to the right. It could have quite easily been avoided. The tactic of blackening the name of the right is also wearing very thin. Hence sound bites from the left about immigration now - as they try to hold onto their jobs.
There is a great deal of rhetoric about immigrants being more involved criminal activities and even more assumptions from some that it’s an established fact. It isn’t. There are no reliable overall statistics. Some nationalities in some circumstances are over represented. Others, in other circumstances being underrepresented. It’s complicated but in general there is no basis whatsoever for the hysteria


Whoever works needs housing and services, whether immigrant or locally born.
 
It’s not necessary to ask why the far right have had a surge in popularity. It’s obvious. There have been a series of events that no government, of any stripe, could neither have avoided nor been unaffected by. The consequences have been equally obvious, unwelcome and unavoidable. When that happens it’s the current politicians who get the blame and those on the sidelines, without any responsibility and just making promises, who reap the benefit.

This isn’t new. The unseen green grass in the next field always being better than the one you are in is a well worn phenomenon. In many ways it’s part of our evolution. The willingness to try new things, only this isn’t new. It’s been tried before. Lest we forget!

Hopefully we won’t forget. We will certainly be reminded as I anticipate an amalgam of the great and the good, from all walks of life and political spectrums doing so. There will always be the political opportunists willing to sacrifice their country’s interests in order to share power by doing deals with the devil, but I don’t sense there are too many.

So don’t rule out a grand coalition. A national government formed to ensure the UK remains free of the kind of politics we are witnessing in the USA.

The Labour Party are actually doing some very wise, progressive, bold and necessary things at present. Things that when better understood could easily reverse the trends. Speeding up the trial process, requiring NEETs to accept training, negotiating with the EU for the ECHR to reform the way the Court interprets the rights of migrants not entitled to be here, etc.
Utter you know what - even for you.
 
It’s not necessary to ask why the far right have had a surge in popularity. It’s obvious. There have been a series of events that no government, of any stripe, could neither have avoided nor been unaffected by. The consequences have been equally obvious, unwelcome and unavoidable. When that happens it’s the current politicians who get the blame and those on the sidelines, without any responsibility and just making promises, who reap the benefit.

This isn’t new. The unseen green grass in the next field always being better than the one you are in is a well worn phenomenon. In many ways it’s part of our evolution. The willingness to try new things, only this isn’t new. It’s been tried before. Lest we forget!

Hopefully we won’t forget. We will certainly be reminded as I anticipate an amalgam of the great and the good, from all walks of life and political spectrums doing so. There will always be the political opportunists willing to sacrifice their country’s interests in order to share power by doing deals with the devil, but I don’t sense there are too many.

So don’t rule out a grand coalition. A national government formed to ensure the UK remains free of the kind of politics we are witnessing in the USA.

The Labour Party are actually doing some very wise, progressive, bold and necessary things at present. Things that when better understood could easily reverse the trends. Speeding up the trial process, requiring NEETs to accept training, negotiating with the EU for the ECHR to reform the way the Court interprets the rights of migrants not entitled to be here, etc.
The trouble is Wisbech, that if you keep doing the same thing you normally get the same result. The public don’t want the same result.
A coalition keeps out Le Pen, AFD and would doubtless keep out Farage; basically denying the public what they voted for. That can lead to anarchy as there is no alternative to getting what the public want.
So the establishment should let Farage have his moment and after 5 years we can change our minds if we want to.
Lammy is saying the right things about ECHR adjustments but the luvvies are already speaking out against it; and would he really be saying such things if Reform wasn’t so popular?
 
Read it and weep Corny.

Even in the most socialist parts of Britain Reform are out there challenging.

Your politics are of the past.....and deservedly so as it's been utter failure....unless you're a landlord making profit off of its failure of course.

1765374278650.webp
 
There is a great deal of rhetoric about immigrants being more involved criminal activities and even more assumptions from some that it’s an established fact. It isn’t. There are no reliable overall statistics. Some nationalities in some circumstances are over represented. Others, in other circumstances being underrepresented. It’s complicated but in general there is no basis whatsoever for the hysteria


Whoever works needs housing and services, whether immigrant or locally born.

There doesn't really need to be a real basis in stats. In politics the truth doesn't really matter. Surely, you've been around long enough to notice? I understand your point. It is more complex. For example, we don't really get Sikh , Hindu, Jewish, Japanese, Buddhist offenders - more or less at all. There's a lot more too. It's actually probably worse depending on how you view the second generation. Many are fed up with being gaslighted that they're somehow British. The only British part is living here. They live in parallel societies often.

However, what Labour fail to see, as let's not beat around the bush, they are not clever at all at anything political; is that what people perceive is the most important factor. Other governments have understood this. It's pretty basic. But let's face it, none of our recent governments have been able to do the basics in most areas.

People perceive immigration as the problem. When they're harassed in the street or pickpocketed, they don't wonder if it's a British citizen. They don't ask to see the passport or documents. What they see with their eyes informs them. It also informs me. People are not that trusting anymore. They've had enough of omissions, inquiries or failure to take statistics for some reason. Even the most ignorant people are not taking the government's word for it. They're not interested. They use what they see in the world around them as their facts.

Open your eyes: both of your areas are not what they used to be. They should be enriched according to some. You see it yourself. Contrarianism isn't working here either. I used to visit Cornwall and used to live in Wisbech. I've seen the clear decline in both. Believe it or not, I know that both of us remember when Wisbech was nice. Seems quite unbelievable now.
 
There is a great deal of rhetoric about immigrants being more involved criminal activities and even more assumptions from some that it’s an established fact. It isn’t. There are no reliable overall statistics. Some nationalities in some circumstances are over represented. Others, in other circumstances being underrepresented. It’s complicated but in general there is no basis whatsoever for the hysteria


Whoever works needs housing and services, whether immigrant or locally born.
What is complicated about it. Surely 1 illegal migrant committing a crime is 1 too many
 
It’s not necessary to ask why the far right have had a surge in popularity. It’s obvious. There have been a series of events that no government, of any stripe, could neither have avoided nor been unaffected by. The consequences have been equally obvious, unwelcome and unavoidable. When that happens it’s the current politicians who get the blame and those on the sidelines, without any responsibility and just making promises, who reap the benefit.

This isn’t new. The unseen green grass in the next field always being better than the one you are in is a well worn phenomenon. In many ways it’s part of our evolution. The willingness to try new things, only this isn’t new. It’s been tried before. Lest we forget!

Hopefully we won’t forget. We will certainly be reminded as I anticipate an amalgam of the great and the good, from all walks of life and political spectrums doing so. There will always be the political opportunists willing to sacrifice their country’s interests in order to share power by doing deals with the devil, but I don’t sense there are too many.

So don’t rule out a grand coalition. A national government formed to ensure the UK remains free of the kind of politics we are witnessing in the USA.

The Labour Party are actually doing some very wise, progressive, bold and necessary things at present. Things that when better understood could easily reverse the trends. Speeding up the trial process, requiring NEETs to accept training, negotiating with the EU for the ECHR to reform the way the Court interprets the rights of migrants not entitled to be here, etc.
There you go, far right again. Define far right for me !
 
It’s not necessary to ask why the far right have had a surge in popularity. It’s obvious. There have been a series of events that no government, of any stripe, could neither have avoided nor been unaffected by. The consequences have been equally obvious, unwelcome and unavoidable. When that happens it’s the current politicians who get the blame and those on the sidelines, without any responsibility and just making promises, who reap the benefit.

This isn’t new. The unseen green grass in the next field always being better than the one you are in is a well worn phenomenon. In many ways it’s part of our evolution. The willingness to try new things, only this isn’t new. It’s been tried before. Lest we forget!

Hopefully we won’t forget. We will certainly be reminded as I anticipate an amalgam of the great and the good, from all walks of life and political spectrums doing so. There will always be the political opportunists willing to sacrifice their country’s interests in order to share power by doing deals with the devil, but I don’t sense there are too many.

So don’t rule out a grand coalition. A national government formed to ensure the UK remains free of the kind of politics we are witnessing in the USA.

The Labour Party are actually doing some very wise, progressive, bold and necessary things at present. Things that when better understood could easily reverse the trends. Speeding up the trial process, requiring NEETs to accept training, negotiating with the EU for the ECHR to reform the way the Court interprets the rights of migrants not entitled to be here, etc.
There you go, far right again. Define far right for me !
 
There you go, far right again. Define far right for me !
Heads up fellow HOLers.

Censorship on Social Media is a big problem. Be aware of the threat even on this site!

There is a poster, Spindle, who works for the military threatening to report Palace fans to the Security Services for not taking the current government view on subjects. Ukraine war in this case, but the threat can potentially be applied to just about anything he chooses.

1765390853167.webp
 
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Read it and weep Corny.

Even in the most socialist parts of Britain Reform are out there challenging.

Your politics are of the past.....and deservedly so as it's been utter failure....unless you're a landlord making profit off of its failure of course.

View attachment 2453
No weeping from me. Ever! My nickname being “Mr Tenacity” wasn’t earned because of considering defeat.

I don’t dismiss the current situation. It’s there in plain sight. Never though forget the word that’s most important. Which is current.

I want to avoid another bout of “Farage Regret”. We have suffered it over Brexit and, with sufficient explanations and warnings, we can avoid a second.

I can already imagine the posters and the adverts. “Do you really trust the man who brought you Brexit and admires Trump? Think before it’s too late.”
 
The trouble is Wisbech, that if you keep doing the same thing you normally get the same result. The public don’t want the same result.
A coalition keeps out Le Pen, AFD and would doubtless keep out Farage; basically denying the public what they voted for. That can lead to anarchy as there is no alternative to getting what the public want.
So the establishment should let Farage have his moment and after 5 years we can change our minds if we want to.
Lammy is saying the right things about ECHR adjustments but the luvvies are already speaking out against it; and would he really be saying such things if Reform wasn’t so popular?
Unless they achieve an overall majority it wouldn’t though be denying the public what they voted for. If more voted for other parties and those parties form a government that’s what they voted for!

In some ways making Reform actually have to take decisions would be the quickest way to discredit them entirely. Their “plans” are no better than click bait!

The problem though is that we have more than enough problems already. Adding another level is just stupid.
 
What is complicated about it. Surely 1 illegal migrant committing a crime is 1 too many
One criminal committing a crime is a crime too many. Whoever is involved.

We aren’t talking though of just illegal immigrants, but immigrants in general.

Stopping illegal immigration is something we all agree on.

Just recently I had occasion to socialise together with my wife and her nursing colleagues. Many of whom come from overseas and are some of the nicest, hardest working people you could find anywhere. They are a credit to themselves, their countries and to the NHS.

I was hugely disappointed to hear several of them say they are thinking of moving elsewhere. Not for the money, but because they are now feeling unwelcome. Not unappreciated, because their patients do, but Reform and Farage were mentioned more than once.

Do we really want this to happen?
 
Unless they achieve an overall majority it wouldn’t though be denying the public what they voted for. If more voted for other parties and those parties form a government that’s what they voted for!

In some ways making Reform actually have to take decisions would be the quickest way to discredit them entirely. Their “plans” are no better than click bait!

The problem though is that we have more than enough problems already. Adding another level is just stupid.
In 2010 didn’t the Liberals form a coalition with the Conservatives to keep Labour out, even though Liberal policies were more in line with Labour’s?
Would the Conservatives form a coalition with Reform to keep Labour out? Sure they both say no today, but in 2029 we don’t know how bad things will be.
Or would the Conservatives join with Labour to protect the status quo?
Le Pen got the most seats but there were some very strange bedfellows formed to keep her out at any costs.
 
There you go, far right again. Define far right for me !
No need. If you don’t accept that the AfD and Le Pen are far right then there’s little point in me trying to. They certainly aren’t centre right are they?

Reform are tarred with the same brush. Guilt by association might be unfair but that’s how voters think and they certainly are going to be encouraged to.
 

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