US Politics

[Phil’s Barber]

A ridiculous post,none of those are an excuse for murder.

I’ll take that as a NO then.

It’s not ridiculous as those were the circumsrances facing the law enforment officers in that scenario.

Your post saying you’ve been in bigger fights with your sister is the ridiculous irrelevant one.

 

[Phil’s Barber]

The one where Minnesota state have already had to file a case because DHS officials were removing evidence and preventing state officials from accessing the crime scene?

https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.mnd.230788/gov.uscourts.mnd.230788.1.0.pdf

Maybe…but how about you address my question to you and substantiate your initial point, as requested 3 times now.

 

[Phil’s Barber]

You mean don’t defend democracy against authoritarianism?

The right to peacefully protest is protected by the First Amendment in the USA.

They are detaining criminals, these are illegal immigrants who are to be deported!

How can you defend people, trying to obstruct law enforcement officers in the lawful execution of their duty, who then become violent, aggressive, non compliant and resist arrest?

I thought you were all for the rule of law?

 

[Common Sense Club]

You mean don’t defend democracy against authoritarianism?

The right to peacefully protest is protected by the First Amendment in the USA.

Protest against what? Your gardener being removed from the country because he entered it illegally because it means you’d have to now mow your own lawn?
Or protesting about what the Minnesota authorities have been doing in allowing $8 billion being fraudulently claimed?
Some people just like to protest; anything against what the Trump government do is why they turn up.

 

[Wisbech Eagle]

Except he didn't. He managed to carry on harassing and grabbing someone else before 3 officers pulled him away. There's plenty of video

Except he didn’t! I am reposting the analysis from BBC Verify. Who have more resources and expertise than either of us. This seems pretty definitive to me and shows the immediate conclusions of Trump and his lackeys to be exactly what they appeared from the outset. Whitewashing as usual!

“The footage shows an agent pushing someone over, with Pretti standing between them and the agent while filming on his phone.

The agent pepper sprays Pretti in the face. Pretti raises his hand defensively and turns away, pockets his phone, and starts to help the woman on the floor as the agent continues spraying.

Other agents rush over. They drag Pretti away and several agents wrestle him to the floor. Pretti then tries to crawl away - he’s clearly not holding a gun.

An agent in a grey jacket is seen reaching for something from Pretti’s waist. Next to him, another agent draws his gun.

The agent in the grey jacket turns away from Pretti, holding what appears to be a pistol.

Less than a second later, an agent shoots Pretti. Ten shots are heard in total.

For context, after the shooting, Homeland Security Secretary Kristi Noem gave the following description of what happened: "An individual approached US Border Patrol officers with a 9mm semi-automatic handgun. The officers attempted to disarm the suspect but the armed suspect violently resisted. Fearing for his life and the lives and safety of fellow officers, an agent fired defensive shots."

 

[beak]

I’ll take that as a NO then.

It’s not ridiculous as those were the circumsrances facing the law enforment officers in that scenario.

Your post saying you’ve been in bigger fights with your sister is the ridiculous irrelevant one.

The ignore button comes into play.

 

[Phil’s Barber]

The ignore button comes into play.

I couldn’t give two hoots.

If you want to introduce pathetic comparisons then more fool you.
I presume because you can’t or won’t debate the matter with an open mind.

You’ve already made your mind up it was murder and won’t take into account any of the circumstances the law enforcement officers were facing. Based on such little evidence and so few actual facts that is a huge concern, especially as you have implied on here that you are a magistrate! 😳

 

[Wisbech Eagle]

Protest against what? Your gardener being removed from the country because he entered it illegally because it means you’d have to now mow your own lawn?
Or protesting about what the Minnesota authorities have been doing in allowing $8 billion being fraudulently claimed?
Some people just like to protest; anything against what the Trump government do is why they turn up.

They aren’t protesting about “the loss of their gardener”! Don’t be ridiculous.

They are protesting about the unnecessary use of excessive force by a poorly trained para military force who weren’t invited to their city and are unwelcome there, the deliberate exclusion of local law enforcement from investigations into their behaviour and the treatment of those who object. Treatment that has resulted in lethal force being used against citizens.

It’s indefensible. Anyone who attempts to justify it just makes themselves look ridiculous.

 

[Spiderman]

They aren’t protesting about “the loss of their gardener”! Don’t be ridiculous.

They are protesting about the unnecessary use of excessive force by a poorly trained para military force who weren’t invited to their city and are unwelcome there, the deliberate exclusion of local law enforcement from investigations into their behaviour and the treatment of those who object. Treatment that has resulted in lethal force being used against citizens.

It’s indefensible. Anyone who attempts to justify it just makes themselves look ridiculous.

Not sure that is totally correct. The demonstration were initially against the detention and removal of illegal migrants and foreign criminals. Why would anyone want to defend them?

 

[steeleye20]

‘This is what fascism looks like’ - terror in Minneapolis reminiscent of civil war.

The USA being compared to pre-WW2 fascist Germany (actually enabled by USA loans).

The 'Board of Directors' compared to the mafia or the bar in 'Star Wars'.

Military and pyschological dominance paid for by borrowing astronomical amounts, currently 38 trillion dollars and rising.

Carney has been bold and also smart, while the motor-mouth USA President bellows he has been doing serious deals China is the latest.

The USA is the most unstable country in a world which needed just that.

😎

 

[Stirlingsays]

‘This is what fascism looks like’ - terror in Minneapolis reminiscent of civil war.

The USA being compared to pre-WW2 fascist Germany (actually enabled by USA loans).

The 'Board of Directors' compared to the mafia or the bar in 'Star Wars'.

Military and pyschological dominance paid for by borrowing astronomical amounts, currently 38 trillion dollars and rising.

Carney has been bold and also smart, while the motor-mouth USA President bellows he has been doing serious deals China is the latest.

The USA is the most unstable country in a world which needed just that.

😎

If it were communism you'd be loving it.....or Islamic rule presumably.......It's why I don't really get why you support the English cricket team....Don't you support Pakistan when they tour here?

Anyway about Carney.

Canada are economically fecked while Trump is president......No two ways about it......there only hope is for a Democratic victory in 28 and even then the Democrats will exact an economic price instead of giving freebies.

A trade deal with China is only sensible if Trump doesn't impose an effective economic blockage.

But is Trump serious.....I don't know the numbers, insomuch of how much that would also effect America..... but I do know that Trump should be laser focused on the economy.

 

[Stirlingsays]

My reading of the situation is that if Trump doesn't suspend democracy after the mid terms then he and his family are planning to move to Israel to avoid extradition.

Because I think if the Democrats take power again they will just revert to trying to jail Trump and anyone connected to him.

Can't see the incentives on the right......The Democrats really really screwed up trying to jail Trump a couple of years back.

All this is leading up to what I was predicting on here ten years ago.

 

[Stirlingsays]

Maybe…but how about you address my question to you and substantiate your initial point, as requested 3 times now.

He's a pick and chooser.

 

[Frenchaigle]

Lots of assumptions and sweeping statements from another armchair expert.

Have you ever been a member of law enforcement?
Have you ever policed a demonstration?
Have you ever been authorised to carry a firearm in such a situation?
Have you ever been struggling with an armed subject who may shoot & kill you?

Why not let the investigation establish the facts of what happened, instead of making a host of assumptions, sweeping statements and accusations?

Just used my eyes 👀

 

[Frenchaigle]

My reading of the situation is that if Trump doesn't suspend democracy after the mid terms then he and his family are planning to move to Israel to avoid extradition.

Because I think if the Democrats take power again they will just revert to trying to jail Trump and anyone connected to him.

Can't see the incentives on the right......The Democrats really really screwed up trying to jail Trump a couple of years back.

All this is leading up to what I was predicting on here ten years ago.

Trump should have been banged up after Jan 6 .
50/60 years ago in many countries he would of been executed for treason .
300 years before ,hung drawn and quarterd , he may of been given mercy and simply beheaded .

 

[Common Sense Club]

They aren’t protesting about “the loss of their gardener”! Don’t be ridiculous.

They are protesting about the unnecessary use of excessive force by a poorly trained para military force who weren’t invited to their city and are unwelcome there, the deliberate exclusion of local law enforcement from investigations into their behaviour and the treatment of those who object. Treatment that has resulted in lethal force being used against citizens.

It’s indefensible. Anyone who attempts to justify it just makes themselves look ridiculous.

So, the government has to wait for the population to invite federal agents into the area to solve a problem. Except that Minnesota presumably doesn’t think there is a problem with illegal immigrants and foreign criminals in their midst. The government disagrees.
The left cannot stand the fact that Trump has stopped the flood of illegals across the border and can now concentrate on removing those who are illegally in the USA. He cannot be seen to be actually solving problems hence the protests.
Let the government (you know, the democratically elected people that make decisions for us) get on with it without interference and everybody but the illegals and foreign criminals will be happy. No?

 

[Common Sense Club]

Trump should have been banged up after Jan 6 .
50/60 years ago in many countries he would of been executed for treason .
300 years before ,hung drawn and quarterd , he may of been given mercy and simply beheaded .

The USA is not Islamic yet, but I take your point.

 

[eaglesdare]

Trump should have been banged up after Jan 6 .
50/60 years ago in many countries he would of been executed for treason .
300 years before ,hung drawn and quarterd , he may of been given mercy and simply beheaded .

Trump called for peace and wasn't convicted of treason and the rioters acted independently.

Maybe ask the BBC panorama show what Trump really said......oh wait

 

[DanH]

Trump called for peace and wasn't convicted of treason and the rioters acted independently.

Maybe ask the BBC panorama show what Trump really said......oh wait

 

[Wisbech Eagle]

Not sure that is totally correct. The demonstration were initially against the detention and removal of illegal migrants and foreign criminals. Why would anyone want to defend them?

I am not sure you are correct.

That the ICE agents would not have an excuse to behave as they do without the stated aim of detaining and removing illegal migrants and foreign criminals it isn’t this that enrages people. Indeed it’s frequently stated by the Trump officials that the concentration is specifically on the criminals when what is very obvious is that most of what they do is to detain anyone who looks as though they could be an illegal. Trawling through a population in that way scoops up, by chance, some illegals with a criminal record, but also scoops up legal citizens alongside illegals with no criminal records.

Whilst the citizens get released they, quite rightly, are offended by the purely racial profiling. The illegals who have often been there years, working hard and building a life for themselves have in the past been offered the prospect of becoming “dreamer citizens”. They might be illegal but there is nonetheless a lot of sympathy for them.

So that’s why they are defended. Purely racial profiling of citizens and sympathy for decent people. When heavily armed bully boy thugs come into your neighbourhood and start abusing people, and then using lethal force, people protest.