Sage SACKED, according to reports

[park the bus]

I sort of get this argument but regardless of footballing philosophy we just don’t look like a very well coached team. Being on the front foot and aiming to win the ball back high up can’t be an excuse to have a defensive shape that leaves you exposed. It also can’t be a reason to not work on defending set plays (if stories are to be believed). That is just bad management.

Also the job of a manager is to get results. That doesn’t necessarily mean abandoning your whole approach but there has to be a dose of pragmatism in there.

Where you are spot on is it is not like this was a surprise when we appointed Sage. That’s what led a lot of fans and pundits to raise their eyebrows at the appointment. It looked like the wrong one for where we were and has proven to be a disaster. That is on the club.

Yes exactly. And Sage will get the sack because his methods haven't worked with this squad in the Premiership, which is par for the course. I suggest that this could have been foreseen. I'd also say that Parish & Co had around 8 months to search diligently for a new manager when Glasner said he wasn't going to sign a new contract but would see out his existing one. And they opted for Sage. It's all on them.

 

[silvertop]

You are confusing the lack of public pronouncements with procrastination.

I don’t think for one moment that nothing is happening. Delaying the announcements until all the ducks are in a row is how we do things. Steve doesn’t react to media speculation or pressure.

I suspect matters are hanging with Man Utd. Pochettino has made no secret of the fact that he wants to manage them. I suspect Eddie Howe is also awaiting the meeting today as he may also have his hat in that ring.

And we may want Howe over Frank. Howe has publicly rejected the idea of coming to us, but that just signaled his interest in Man Utd. If Man Utd go with Poch, he may suddenly be available for us. His PR back pedaling will be a thing of the past if he gets our defence reorganized.

If Man Utd decide to stick with what they have for the time being, Poch and Howe will revert to waiting mode; and Frank could be announced for us by the end of the week.

 

[PatrickA]

The club's preferred appointment in the summer was allegedly Iraola, and supposedly he was keen to join until Liverpool came in.
The story has emerged with the current links with Frank that he was also interviewed in the summer.
That story suggests that at that point Frank didn't want to return to football at that time, which begs the question why go for the interview?
Dyche was inevitably linked because he's experienced, out of work and a solid appointment.

That's 3 experienced Premier League managers, who all heve their merits.

Which begs the question why did we end up with a relatively inexperienced manager new to the Premier League?
Yes, he had some success last season in France - but is that enough to base such a significant appointment?

I recall Willo at the time of the appointment revealing Sage's lack of experience and wondering whether it would all end in tears.
It might seem like hindsight now, but if you look hard enough the evidence of the size gamble in appointing him was there.

 

[park the bus]

Sage thought he could adopt his methods, that he used in France. Reports have been coming out, that he doesn't place any emphasis on defending and it is not practiced in training. He just presses from the front line, which we have all seen, that it leaves us exposed at the back, resulting in normally 2 or 3 goals against.
It wouldn't matter, which players Sage wanted to bring in, his system doesn't work in the Premier where the level of opposition is higher. We were always regarded as difficult to play against under Glasner and Hodgson, now its open season to increase the oppositions goal difference.

Sure, but as I have said, this is just Sage being Sage. The board had 8 months to identify a new manger, and ended up with Sage after a no doubt diligent recruitment process. They must have outlined what they expected with the secure belief that Sage was the man.
In other words it's the same (failed) process that brought in Frank de Boer.

 

[silvertop]

Yes exactly. And Sage will get the sack because his methods haven't worked with this squad in the Premiership, which is par for the course. I suggest that this could have been foreseen. I'd also say that Parish & Co had around 8 months to search diligently for a new manager when Glasner said he wasn't going to sign a new contract but would see out his existing one. And they opted for Sage. It's all on them.

I might have opted for Sage too. Similar metrics for Glasner and look how that ended.

We shop in smaller ponds. Mid price. Risk. Some work. Some do not.

And look at those clubs who shop in the big boy market. Proven managers at the very highest level and for the very premium salary. Do they all work as hoped?

 

[Painter]

Sure, but as I have said, this is just Sage being Sage. The board had 8 months to identify a new manger, and ended up with Sage after a no doubt diligent recruitment process. They must have outlined what they expected with the secure belief that Sage was the man.
In other words it's the same (failed) process that brought in Frank de Boer.

The problem is, that the Premier League is unrelenting, new managers need to hit the ground running, otherwise they are under pressure. FDB and Sage may of worked out given more time, but the threat of financial armourgeddon to clubs if relegated, doesn't allow them time.

 

[Willo]

The club's preferred appointment in the summer was allegedly Iraola, and supposedly he was keen to join until Liverpool came in.
The story has emerged with the current links with Frank that he was also interviewed in the summer.
That story suggests that at that point Frank didn't want to return to football at that time, which begs the question why go for the interview?
Dyche was inevitably linked because he's experienced, out of work and a solid appointment.

That's 3 experienced Premier League managers, who all heve their merits.

Which begs the question why did we end up with a relatively inexperienced manager new to the Premier League?
Yes, he had some success last season in France - but is that enough to base such a significant appointment?

I recall Willo at the time of the appointment revealing Sage's lack of experience and wondering whether it would all end in tears.
It might seem like hindsight now, but if you look hard enough the evidence of the size gamble in appointing him was there.

My reservations were not just confined to HOL !
I was met with some antithetical opinions, some expressed with some asperity.
I take no pleasure in witnessing how events have unfolded, and I have consistently wished Sage every success at our club.

 

[NEILLO]

Sure, but as I have said, this is just Sage being Sage. The board had 8 months to identify a new manger, and ended up with Sage after a no doubt diligent recruitment process. They must have outlined what they expected with the secure belief that Sage was the man.
In other words it's the same (failed) process that brought in Frank de Boer.

I think it's a little different.

de Boer was certainly a departure from the usual type of Palace appointment.

Sage was hired because the Board ( well, Parish let's face it ) saw it as a continuation of the work done by Glasner. Similar tactical approach. And off the back of recent success in France.

According to some reports, Parish considered firing Sage in September as there were concerns about his defensive set up. A bit rich when you consider what options he had ( and still has ) available to him.

I try to stay objective when critisising Steve Parish, not least because he's best friends with a friend of mine. However, he's presided over a distinctly rocky ship for the last 12 months. The Conference League win has only papered over the cracks.

 

[VinceHilaire]

I don’t think this is a case of ‘if’ Sage gets sacked. Personally, I believe he has already been relieved of his duties as manager.

Too many media outlets have now reported that he has gone for me to believe this is simply speculation. I’m confident that someone close to the club may have leaked the information to the press.

My feeling is that Parish is now putting plans in place for Sage’s replacement, along with assembling a new coaching team. In the meantime, it wouldn’t surprise me if Paddy and Paul Powell were asked to step up and take training.

With the players due to return at the end of the week, the timing is becoming increasingly important. I would be surprised if we hear anything official over the next 48 hours, but I suspect plenty is happening behind the scenes.

It’s now a question of when the club is ready to make it public and who will be taking charge next.

 

[Willo]

The problem is, that the Premier League is unrelenting, new managers need to hit the ground running, otherwise they are under pressure. FDB and Sage may of worked out given more time, but the threat of financial armourgeddon to clubs if relegated, doesn't allow them time.

As I have messaged on a few occasions, Thomas Frank lost 8 of his first 10 games at Brentford but that was in the Championship.Brentford were 7th after 12 League games when he succeeded Dean Smith and they finished 11th that season.

 

[NEILLO]

As I have messaged on a few occasions, Thomas Frank lost 8 of his first 10 games at Brentford but that was in the Championship.Brentford were 7th after 12 League games when he succeeded Dean Smith and they finished 11th that season.

And Glasner went 8 games without a win 2 years ago.

I think the difference is that there was evidence that improvement was not only possible but likely.

I just don't see any chance of that under Sage, regrettably

 

[taylors lovechild]

People talk about Sage's lack of experience, but Fabian Hürzeler actually had less experience than Sage when Brighton appointed him. Keith Andrews was promoted from within. Arbeloa had managed just 28 senior games when he was chosen by Fulham. For me, in the long term, the issue is not the amount of experience; it is getting the right fit for the path the club want to choose. Is there a plan? Or was Sage chosen simply because he'd had some success in France? We don't know that. What does seem apparent is that the small/mid-sized clubs with seemingly the best scouting networks are the ones who are punching - like Brighton, Brentford and Bournemouth. It would make sense that these clubs also use their scouting networks to identify the right manager.

Right now, we need someone with experience who can steady the ship, get us organised, and make us competitive. It's frustrating; we had a chance to reset, and instead we have gone backwards and find ourselves needing a firefighter again.

 

[Phil’s Barber]

As weird as it seems I’d actually just sit it out with Sage (provided he’s got the support of the dressing room). I’m not saying we should, I’m just saying as me, the fanatical supporter, I would.

We played really well against Liverpool for large periods of the game. I’ve enjoyed going to games this season and our attacking play has been a pleasure to watch. Not something we will be able to say with Dyche, Frank or Roy in charge!

Yes we’ve been shocking in defence but he’s also had a lot of misfortune with Lacroix & Munoz being sold, Hendo, Tomiyasu, JPM and Sarr being injured plus red card suspensions and Sarr’s tantrums.

I’d back him with top class defensive re-inforcements in January and stick with him.

Fergie was one game from the sack and look how that turned out. Frank had a very poor start at Brentford, as did Glasner with us and last Season Br*ghton supporters were desperate to get rid of Hürzeler because they said he was f*cking clueless!

We’ve been singing his name loud & proud at matches, not one banner or chant calling for his head.
I love our club and what it stands for. Just think how good the bond between club, supporters and manager would be if he turned this around and came through it all.

 

[DANGERCLOSE]

Has he gone yet? or could we be giving him another chance?

 

[Willo]

And Glasner went 8 games without a win 2 years ago.

I think the difference is that there was evidence that improvement was not only possible but likely.

I just don't see any chance of that under Sage, regrettably

Glasner was an experienced manager with nearly 400 games to his name before joining us.
In his first season at Wolfsburg they qualified for the Europa League by finishing 7th in the Bundesliga.
He guided Wolfsburg to 4th and they qualified for the Champions League.
He won the Europa League with Eintracht Frankfurt.
Sage arrived at our club as an inexperienced manager and on the back of a single stand-out season in France. It has been well documented on HOL that I had reservations about his appointment but I of course sincerely hoped he would be a success.

 

[MrRobbo]

The club's preferred appointment in the summer was allegedly Iraola, and supposedly he was keen to join until Liverpool came in.
The story has emerged with the current links with Frank that he was also interviewed in the summer.
That story suggests that at that point Frank didn't want to return to football at that time, which begs the question why go for the interview?
Dyche was inevitably linked because he's experienced, out of work and a solid appointment.

That's 3 experienced Premier League managers, who all heve their merits.

Which begs the question why did we end up with a relatively inexperienced manager new to the Premier League?
Yes, he had some success last season in France - but is that enough to base such a significant appointment?

I recall Willo at the time of the appointment revealing Sage's lack of experience and wondering whether it would all end in tears.
It might seem like hindsight now, but if you look hard enough the evidence of the size gamble in appointing him was there.

What he did with Lyon, and then Lens was seriously impressive. Lens particularly.

Everyone loves banging the experience drum, especially premier league experience. Talking like its an absolute mandatory.

Most successful managers in the prem had no previous prem experience

 

[PatrickA]

As weird as it seems I’d actually just sit it out with Sage (provided he’s got the support of the dressing room). I’m not saying we should, I’m just saying as me, the fanatical supporter, I would.

We played really well against Liverpool for large periods of the game. I’ve enjoyed going to games this season and our attacking play has been a pleasure to watch. Not something we will be able to say with Dyche, Frank or Roy in charge!

Yes we’ve been shocking in defence but he’s also had a lot of misfortune with Lacroix & Munoz being sold, Hendo, Tomiyasu, JPM and Sarr being injured plus red card suspensions and Sarr’s tantrums.

I’d back him with top class defensive re-inforcements in January and stick with him.

Fergie was one game from the sack and look how that turned out. Frank had a very poor start at Brentford, as did Glasner with us and last Season Br*ghton supporters were desperate to get rid of Hürzeler because they said he was f*cking clueless!

We’ve been singing his name loud & proud at matches, not one banner or chant calling for his head.
I love our club and what it stands for. Just think how good the bond between club, supporters and manager would be if he turned this around and came through it all.

In many ways you make a persuasive case, but I honestly don't think we can continue to concede an average of 2.4 goals per game under Sage.
That's the bottom line.

 

[Teddy Eagle]

I might have opted for Sage too. Similar metrics for Glasner and look how that ended.

We shop in smaller ponds. Mid price. Risk. Some work. Some do not.

And look at those clubs who shop in the big boy market. Proven managers at the very highest level and for the very premium salary. Do they all work as hoped?

The experience of Man United, Tottenham, Chelsea and the like shows they don't. Albeit their managers are working to higher expectations than ours they have much greater resources available and many still don't do well.

 

[doombear]

The problem is, that the Premier League is unrelenting, new managers need to hit the ground running, otherwise they are under pressure. FDB and Sage may of worked out given more time, but the threat of financial armourgeddon to clubs if relegated, doesn't allow them time.

FdB was never going to work however much time he was given for the simple reason he was an arrogant sod who got everyone's backs up.

 

[Teddy Eagle]

FdB was never going to work however much time he was given for the simple reason he was an arrogant sod who got everyone's backs up.

What name does he use on here?