Brighton vs Crystal Palace match thread

[Save Dwindlehurst]

Our worst performance of the season by far. Second to every ball, out thought, outfought and outplayed by, let's be honest, a very good Brighton team. I expected to be beaten but not in that way. I don't expect Sage to be sacked after this result unless the wheels fall off in the next couple of games, I expect him to see it through to the next international break.

I was pleased to see Mateta getting stuck in - pity he had his usual glaring miss when set up nicely. I agree re Wharton also. He was poor today trying to still do his usual stuff in a context where it wasn't going to work because virtually every Palace player on the pitch was having a 'mare. So many basic errors.

Wharton was outnumbered and out muscled and consequently had no time on the ball. Surely it’s time to play 3 in midfield? It’s not as though our ‘wing’ backs are contributing anything…

 

[Willo]

I’m afraid I’m coming round to your way of thinking Willo…..

This is a disturbing development as far as you are concerned !

 

[rob1969]

Whist it is true that we have a worse team now than in May - most of that is not on Sage. In the same way that most of the poor play and errors are not. What he is responsible for however is developing tactics that best suit the material he has to work with. It is pointless setting tactics that the players do not suit - or cannot play.

Today Brighton looked like a team -a team who knew what they were doing. By comparison we mostly looked more like a cobbled together group who at times looked completely out of their depth.

Sage's downfall will be if he doesn't play our best players - of whom we probably have only six or seven with real PL quality - in their best positions and - build his tactics to suit those players.
He has to change - he has to adapt! if not he will not succeed - and more importantly - nor will Palace !

 

[EagleEddie]

Sensible post amongst those who resemble headless chickens. Parish isn't going to panic, not his style.

I would imagine, talks will take place, then a reassessment during the next International break in November.

I’m not that sensible as I just travelled to watch that twaddle. But I’m thinking positively and glass half full ….. so yes I hope Sage gets sacked in the morning otherwise we will not survive this season. Obvious to the majority of us!

 

[JHB]

To my mind, Munoz was not the player of old after his injury.
Khalaili has not been impressive and Mingueza has hardly had our supporters in raptures.
I have had informed gentlemen raising questions about our summer recruitment and I for one, in the main, share their views.

I agree Munoz wasn’t quite what he was. However, it was to much experience to remove to sell him and Lacroix in the same window. Munoz is still a different class to anything his two replacements have shown. Teams are targeting Khalali quite clearly as they’ve identified him as a weak link in a weak defence.

 

[Painter]

Paddy got a yellow card today,which proves at least he has some passion.
I don't agree with Howe as he already turned us down once.
I didn't think that I'd ever say this, but I think you need someone like Sean Dyche to sort out our defence in particular and the entire team in general.

To be clear, Paddy is the defence coach, rather organisation!

Why does anyone think Dyche is the new Messiah? He has been sacked by Burnley, Everton and Forest in the last few seasons, not for doing a great job, but failure.

 

[MarkA333]

I blame Parish… total mismanagement of funds. Sage is out of his depth. He is making Wharton and Mitchell look bad. Sorry, he has to go, sooner rather than later.

 

[Willo]

Calm down ladies, we were never going to win this one. They thrashed the Arse off The Arse last week, they are clearly on a roll.

Yes, there's definitely something wrong with the defence, pretty disorganized, they don't seem to understand their job, I would expect better from seasoned Championship players. Positioning, marking, organizing from the CF, leadership. I don't see the midfield defending the backline either. Surely Sage will be shining the spotlight on the defensive coach, oh they don't have anyone with specific responsibility.

I see that as structural flaw that needs immediate attention.

Sage won't be getting the tin tack this side of the international break as long as they aren't in the relegation zone.

One thing I don't like is public criticism of players, you only get the best out of people if you treat them with respect and that isn't it.

Finally, I have posted before.

No player,or manager, is above criticism and we have to be honest when assessing individual and team performances.
Over the years I have received virulent criticism and whilst I might not have agreed with every 'Jot and tittle', I respected the right of those to express their views.

 

[PatFromSouthCarolina]

Richards plays in the middle when his best position is out on the right.
Today Canvot who is used to playing on the left was deployed on the right to accommodate the very inexperienced Ahanor introduced into the fray in a 'Derby' game.
From my perspective, Lerma should have started down the right.
These are decisions made by Pierre Sage who seems lost on the touchline.

This is my problem with Sage. Ok, one of them…You lose your center Center Back. You replace him and it’s only that position that is weakened. However, you move your established left guy to the right, your right guy to the center, then have a revolving door on the left. Now you have weakened the entire back 3. As someone who has played and coached at the collegiate and professional level (baseball, not soccer), that is coaching 101 regardless of the sport. You start moving guys around to replace one guy, you’ve now weakened multiple positions instead of one. Combine that with questionable tactics, and you’ve got a recipe for disaster.

 

[doombear]

I agree with all of this, especially the importance of succession planning. My only reservation is that we don't really know why the club sold la croix and Munoz in the summer. Some reports suggest it's to cover us for FFP, in which case it is perhaps more understandable. If it was by choice then it might be a fatal mistake, whoever is in the dugout.

As I've posted elsewhere, the PL and Uefa have different accounting years. Unfortunately, UEFA's tougher 70% year runs from Jan to Dec so takes in that mega Jan 26 splurge of £90m on 2 not very good players, whereas whilst the PL's less strict year runs from Jul to Jun so although it included the Jan 26 splurge it also included the near £70m we collected from Arsenal for Eze. I believe we had to make a big sale in the Summer to meet UEFA rules.

 

[Mark B]

I'm going to blame the rain for the first 10 minutes off odd play. Yes, I'm being delusional and lying to myself. It is my fantasy, let it be.

The bigger issue for me is that even after that, we look apathetic and scared. There is no killer instinct or nasty mindset that can power through when things go wrong. This club needs an animal.

 

[TheBigToePunt]

Wharton was outnumbered and out muscled and consequently had no time on the ball. Surely it’s time to play 3 in midfield? It’s not as though our ‘wing’ backs are contributing anything…

Agreed. Play Kamada, Wharton and Timber in the middle, one less hopeless centre back, and create a place in the team for our best goal scorer.

That would mean not playing a 343 formation, though. I wonder if Sage was appointed, at least in part, because he prefers that system and so would give us continuity?

I hope not. For one thing the way Sage uses the system is totally different to how Glasner does, so it's not consistent anyway. For another, the system should be dictated by the qualities of the best players. It wasn't clear that 343 was the best use of our squad after last Xmas, and that was with La croix and Munoz. It certainly isn't now.

 

[eritheagle]

As I've posted elsewhere, the PL and Uefa have different accounting years. Unfortunately, UEFA's tougher 70% year runs from Jan to Dec so takes in that mega Jan 26 splurge of £90m on 2 not very good players, whereas whilst the PL's less strict year runs from Jul to Jun so although it included the Jan 26 splurge it also included the near £70m we collected from Arsenal for Eze. I believe we had to make a big sale in the Summer to meet UEFA rules.

But isn't the punishment for breaking uefa's rules just a small fine which english teams have just accepted in the past?

 

[Part Time James]

I think if Sage was fired tomorrow I would shrug my shoulders. If he wasn't I'd shrug my shoulders.

We do seem to be in a "rebuild" which is a term weirdly creeping into English football from American sports. It works in North America because none of their sports have a concept of relegation (and an entirely different finance model). So you sign a whole squad of new players and wait 5 years for them to come good whilst they fail to set the world on fire. And it's ok if you come bottom of the league.

If it's to become a thing in football you have to be a lot more careful. You have to be pretty sure you can finish at least 17th. I feel like we can scrape 17th with this squad and manager. That's not quite the same as looking for three teams worse than us, but it equates to the same experience.

 

[MarkA333]

The players look diminished with Sage in charge…

 

[Faz]

We need a leader and it's not Wharton (who had a paricularly poor game today)
Henderson is our supposed captain but we need a leader on the field

100% right on both points

Adam’s game is so so far off, his confidence is shot - he is unable to lead right now

Hughes would be the other guy but he can’t compete beyond 45 mins at this level

Chilwell is other leader but he’s gone awol

They need one to come in Jan when they sell JP

 

[Swindy]

It’s a great shame as it would seem it’s not going to work under Sage as he came with a decent track record. However, as usual & the Parish worshippers won’t like it, he has taken good part of the blame, he has stuffed up another manager - why get rid of Lacroix & Munoz ? again, established players, and again without being replaced properly ? Old long pickets like to do the transfer window on the cheap. All this crap about putting McCarthy in temporary charge because he is ‘Palace through & through’, God, never in a month of Sundays🫣🫣

 

[TheBigToePunt]

As I've posted elsewhere, the PL and Uefa have different accounting years. Unfortunately, UEFA's tougher 70% year runs from Jan to Dec so takes in that mega Jan 26 splurge of £90m on 2 not very good players, whereas whilst the PL's less strict year runs from Jul to Jun so although it included the Jan 26 splurge it also included the near £70m we collected from Arsenal for Eze. I believe we had to make a big sale in the Summer to meet UEFA rules.

I wish they'd say as much. It would be easier to get behind the club and team when you can appreciate the challenges they are facing.

Actually, I wish they'd appointed a manager who was better suited to seeing us through what was always going to be a tough patch given the above.

 

[rikz]

Look at our goal difference, its terrible, we've been terrible in every game apart from leeds, even against poznan, the score could have been anything. Yes we've played some decent football going forward, but nowhere near enough to compensate how terrible we are at the back. I don't see Sage improving us, so why wait, just get rid of him. Yes he's slightly unfortunate with the defence he has inherited, its still not good enough tho.

 

[Part Time James]

It’s a great shame as it would seem it’s not going to work under Sage as he came with a decent track record. However, as usual & the Parish worshippers won’t like it, he has taken good part of the blame, he has stuffed up another manager - why get rid of Lacroix & Munoz ? again, established players, and again without being replaced properly ? Old long pickets like to do the transfer window on the cheap. All this crap about putting McCarthy in temporary charge because he is ‘Palace through & through’, God, never in a month of Sundays🫣🫣

I reserve judgement because I don't know whether Parish consulted Sage and said "do you want to keep a shallow squad of decent players or do you want me to sell them and give you a deeper squad to support a European campaign?"

He might have. He might not have. I don't know, although I respect some people are closer to this than me.