Israel v Hamas

silvertop said:
This is what civilized people do.

Step one - due process. If impossible...

Step two - SF hit squad.

A process that does not even consider step one as an option is not the act of a civilized people.

It also sets a dangerous precedent. Remember after 9/11. Despotic nations took it in turns to attack any domestic resistance to their rule as "terrorist" as they felt licensed given US knee-jerk reaction.
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I can understand the points but it doesn't change the major difference between the targets. I don't quite think they were going to get anyone to arrest him peacefully. I haven't looked into him. No doubt a hero to some, a villain to others. Wonder how many people he gave due process to? I won't be losing any sleep over it, but it looks like some are now so overwrought that Israel can't even kill armed terrorists. I'd have preferred them to do that on October 7th, rather than have to put up with all the death. But consider that a moment, would people be agreeing with Israel for that? Or marching in our increasingly Islamic towns and cities?

I'll say I won't celebrate any killing. When young, I might have done. But it doesn't mean this guy didn't deserve exactly that. It also doesn't mean he did. One side will say ond thing, one side the other. The way it is now. Really, this killing is not that controversial unless you particularly care about this man and whatever his cause is. Which is the tone I'm getting from some here. I'd suggest it's too much anti Israel stuff. No one is all good or all bad. We pretty much all live in a grey area. Some in more grey than others.
 
ASCPFC said:
It's not the same. Average people killed is not quite the same as a genuine terrorist killed. Despite even the ethics or the morality of it, if you're a terrorist or even a freedom fighter, you can genuinely expect that you are putting your life at risk. Someone's going to be out to get you in a nasty way, or not. They're still out to get you and there won't be kid gloves.
I don't think people going to work in 9/11 or on the Tube in 7/7 should quite expect the same level of danger. If we do, then the insane radicals have won.
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I know what you mean to some extent. But the point is that it's not about them, it's about us.

E.g. We can all be forgiven for being content or even pleased to hear that some ISIS terrorist or Ian Huntley has copped it. But the moment we all sit down with a bowl of popcorn to watch the execution while giggling with our mates, we have crossed a line that shows something dark about us.

I am sure Jack the Ripper justified himself because the victims were prostitutes and the streets were better without them.
 
McAhuna said:
I know what you mean to some extent. But the point is that it's not about them, it's about us.

E.g. We can all be forgiven for being content or even pleased to hear that some ISIS terrorist or Ian Huntley has copped it. But the moment we all sit down with a bowl of popcorn to watch the execution while giggling with our mates, we have crossed a line that shows something dark about us.

I am sure Jack the Ripper justified himself because the victims were prostitutes and the streets were better without them.
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Personally, I try and avoid all of those videos. I don't like the idea of the spectacle of public executions.
Keep it quiet, would be my advice. Show people what happens and it might not have the rather simplistic effect the Israelis and Americans think. This probably engenders more hate and resistance than anything else. I can feel it even here from some.
I haven't advocated for this. Merely pointed out the reality. The naive ideas of right and wrong and what really happens, just don't add up. This is the reality of kicking the Hornet's best in Israel.
Just as Israel will feel the reality of kicking the Hornet's nest of Palestine and, for some reason, all of Islam. Just as it always is really. Reaction, counter reaction. It's been the same old story for my whole life. If people weren't dying every day I'd describe it as tedious. That might be a little cruel of me. I can't be the only person sick to death of Middle Eastern politics and their religious bullshit. Their infection should not be brought here - otherwise we catch the same perpetual disease.
 
ASCPFC said:
I can understand the points but it doesn't change the major difference between the targets. I don't quite think they were going to get anyone to arrest him peacefully. I haven't looked into him. No doubt a hero to some, a villain to others. Wonder how many people he gave due process to? I won't be losing any sleep over it, but it looks like some are now so overwrought that Israel can't even kill armed terrorists. I'd have preferred them to do that on October 7th, rather than have to put up with all the death. But consider that a moment, would people be agreeing with Israel for that? Or marching in our increasingly Islamic towns and cities?

I'll say I won't celebrate any killing. When young, I might have done. But it doesn't mean this guy didn't deserve exactly that. It also doesn't mean he did. One side will say ond thing, one side the other. The way it is now. Really, this killing is not that controversial unless you particularly care about this man and whatever his cause is. Which is the tone I'm getting from some here. I'd suggest it's too much anti Israel stuff. No one is all good or all bad. We pretty much all live in a grey area. Some in more grey than others.
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I think you pretty much made our point.

In this case, an arrest, trial and conviction was probably not practical. Thus...

Option two.
 
georgenorman said:
The people complaining about this are the same people who were pretty silent about Charlie Kirk.
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Eh?
I was a fan of Charlie Kirk.
Was the murder of Charlie Kirk awful? Yes
Are the people who celebrated his death awful? Yes
Hope that clears that up.

While we are on the subject. Charlie Kirk had recently been speaking out against Israel and even implied they were complicit in the festival massacre. He was accused of anti-semitism and murdered soon after, which was probably a coincidence.

https://twitter.com/x/status/2098088637548380260
 
Of course, his death was a conspiracy, what a surprise
 
McAhuna said:
Eh?
I was a fan of Charlie Kirk.
Was the murder of Charlie Kirk awful? Yes
Are the people who celebrated his death awful? Yes
Hope that clears that up.

While we are on the subject. Charlie Kirk had recently been speaking out against Israel and even implied they were complicit in the festival massacre. He was accused of anti-semitism and murdered soon after, which was probably a coincidence.

https://twitter.com/x/status/2098088637548380260
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The 'x' video is is an AI fake and has been widely exposed as such.
After Kirk was disgustingly assassinated, Israel’s top leaders stepped forward with tributes. Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu described him as a “lion-hearted friend of Israel” and credited him with defending Judeo-Christian civilization.
 
georgenorman said:
The 'x' video is is an AI fake and has been widely exposed as such.
After Kirk was disgustingly assassinated, Israel’s top leaders stepped forward with tributes. Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu described him as a “lion-hearted friend of Israel” and credited him with defending Judeo-Christian civilization.
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I don't believe it is fake.
Not according to Newsweek, Grok, Google and every AI source

1789408302584.webp

1789408334516.webp
 
georgenorman said:
Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu described him as a “lion-hearted friend of Israel” and credited him with defending Judeo-Christian civilization.
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🤣 It's not like a old Benny would lie, manipulate, break the odd treaty or ceasefire.

So we can all definitely take that at face value 🙄
 
McAhuna said:
I don't believe it is fake.
Not according to Newsweek, Grok, Google and every AI source

View attachment 4265

View attachment 4266
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Really? Every AI source?
Google AI Search
"There is no verified evidence that Charlie Kirk said the statement about Israel and Gaza, and circulating such quotes without confirmation can spread misinformation.
Verified reporting and archived accounts of Charlie Kirk’s public statements, as well as posthumous analysis of his speeches and writings, do not show him making claims like “Bibi and Israel are gonna try to ethnically cleanse Gaza.” Some online sources discussing Charlie Kirk mention AI-generated content, social media fabrications, and unverified statements that have gone viral after his death, which can make false information appear plausible
If your interest is to understand geopolitical events or statements from official parties, consult reliable news organizations or official government communications rather than relying on unverified social media claims linked to deceased individuals. This approach safeguards your accuracy and avoids amplifying false claims.
In short, the claim about Charlie Kirk making this statement is unsubstantiated, and spreading it could contribute to misinformation and misunderstandings about both him and the ongoing situation in Gaza."
 
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