Labour Party politics

[Common Sense Club]

When we were in I do recall being told about discussion of federalism but it was only that.

There was never a real chance of it as none of the member states wanted it.

The background politics from the bigger nations where nationalist populism is gaining traction in all of them means it is politically impossible for the foreseeable future.

Yes…but…the way to get what you want is to silence the opposition. The AFD in Germany are popular, yet there were moves to ban them as being based on Nazi sympathies. Hungary tried to fight against EU centralised dictats and got pressure applied (I can’t remember if it was withholding of funding or similar). Reform may be popular but Labour have a huge majority that could do similar if it gets cornered. They have banned support for Palestinian Action and if the Islamophobia Law ever gets passed, any party that even questions its principles could find themselves banned too. Unlikely? Maybe, but the drip of authoritarianism is often advanced unnoticed by the public.

 

[Badger11]

I've been away for several weeks so this is a genuine question. What happened in the trial for the three guys who torched Starmer's car?

FYI
Also I went to Malta and Italy had no problem with the new EU travel rules, it only took a few moments. I compared myself to the EU queue and they got through by about 2 mins before I did.

 

[silvertop]

Yes…but…the way to get what you want is to silence the opposition. The AFD in Germany are popular, yet there were moves to ban them as being based on Nazi sympathies. Hungary tried to fight against EU centralised dictats and got pressure applied (I can’t remember if it was withholding of funding or similar). Reform may be popular but Labour have a huge majority that could do similar if it gets cornered. They have banned support for Palestinian Action and if the Islamophobia Law ever gets passed, any party that even questions its principles could find themselves banned too. Unlikely? Maybe, but the drip of authoritarianism is often advanced unnoticed by the public.

That has all the trappings of populist paranoia.

And it is laced with irony as there is no political group that grabs onto authoritarianism with as much enthusiasm as the populist far right or far left.

 

[Common Sense Club]

That has all the trappings of populist paranoia.

And it is laced with irony as there is no political group that grabs onto authoritarianism with as much enthusiasm as the populist far right or far left.

So it’s all down to the interpretation of what is far right and what is far left.
Removal of trial by jury - which one?
Overruling local authority decisions - which one?
Suspension of local elections - which one?
Curtailment of free speech - which one?
Far left and far right are both cheeks of the same arse, but sometimes their policies filter through to what is perceived to be centre politics.
Sometimes we don’t notice.

 

[Stirlingsays]

That has all the trappings of populist paranoia.

And it is laced with irony as there is no political group that grabs onto authoritarianism with as much enthusiasm as the populist far right or far left.

Disagree.

Everything we are seeing happening across Britain, Germany and France is with social/neo liberals in power.

Britain arrests more people than Russia for 'unacceptable speech', and it's directing investigations into political opponents, is eager whenever it has an excuse to throw opponents like Robinson in jail.

Investigations and attacks against AfD in Germany, investigations against the far right in France, Le Penn banned from the ballot, right wing activist murdered in France (though to be fair that was by far left activists rather than the French state).

The idea that authoritarianism isn't done by the establishment.....of whatever type is.....well it's idealism that doesn't relate to the reality.

It comes down to who is the least authoritarian......and out of what's there is in Britain it's likely to be Farage, because he's a Thatcherite, and when it came to freedom of speech, she was far better than today.

But who really knows until push comes to shove.

 

[silvertop]

Disagree.

Everything we are seeing happening across Britain, Germany and France is with social/neo liberals in power.

Britain arrests more people than Russia for 'unacceptable speech', and it's directing investigations into political opponents, is eager whenever it has an excuse to throw opponents like Robinson in jail.

Investigations and attacks against AfD in Germany, investigations against the far right in France, Le Penn banned from the ballot, right wing activist murdered in France (though to be fair that was by far left activists rather than the French state).

The idea that authoritarianism isn't done by the establishment.....of whatever type is.....well it's idealism that doesn't relate to the reality.

It comes down to who is the least authoritarian......and out of what's there in Britain it's likely to be Farage, because he's a Thatcherite, and when it came to freedom of speech, she was far better than today.

But who really knows until push comes to shove.

This responds to both you and CSC.

Labour are curtailing freedoms while seeking to portray themselves as advocates of those very freedoms. Pure hypocrisy.

However, as you say, we shall see on the pop right. Only Hungary has had a populist nationalist in power for any period. Perhaps, if Reform come into power, they herald in a golden era of openness and freedom never before seen?

 

[Stirlingsays]

This responds to both you and CSC.

Labour are curtailing freedoms while seeking to portray themselves as advocates of those very freedoms. Pure hypocrisy.

However, as you say, we shall see on the pop right. Only Hungary has had a populist nationalist in power for any period. Perhaps, if Reform come into power, they herald in a golden era of openness and freedom never before seen?

When I think about it regarding authoritarianism, the future is likely party independent and they are all going to be more authoritarian than they were in the past.

Purely because the technology enables them to be.

It's not good....but to what extent will be important.

In fact it's going to be a real challenge to those that regard civil liberties as a cornerstone of what the west should represent, to stop governments and their forever parts like intelligence and security from going full China.

Democracy will be under very real threat regardless of left, right or centre or whatever label we give these ruling overpaid berks.

It's a real question as to whether democracy as you know it, actually survives technological advances.

 

[silvertop]

When I think about it regarding authoritarianism, the future is likely party independent and they are all going to be more authoritarian than they were in the past.

Purely because the technology enables them to be.

It's not good....but to what extent will be important.

In fact it's going to be a real challenge to those that regard civil liberties as a cornerstone of what the west should represent, to stop governments and their forever parts like intelligence and security from going full China.

Democracy will be under very real threat regardless of left, right or centre or whatever label we give these ruling overpaid berks.

It's a real question as to whether democracy as you know it, actually survives technological advances.

In one way it would have been nice to have been one of those overpaid berks.

 

[PalazioVecchio]

regarding authoritarianism, the future is likely party independent and they are all going to be more authoritarian than they were in the past.

Ireland's authoritarian regime banned a populist (Maria Steen) from the Presidential election. , the net result ? We got a Lefty authoritarian into the Presidential Palace.

Ireland’s president ‘proud’ of sister detained by Israel en route to Gaza

Margaret Connolly, the sister of Ireland’s head of state, is among the pro-Gaza activists intercepted by Israel at sea.

www.politico.eu

 

[Stirlingsays]

Ireland's authoritarian regime banned a populist (Maria Steen) from the Presidential election. , the net result ? We got a Lefty authoritarian into the Presidential Palace.

Ireland’s president ‘proud’ of sister detained by Israel en route to Gaza

Margaret Connolly, the sister of Ireland’s head of state, is among the pro-Gaza activists intercepted by Israel at sea.

www.politico.eu

Yep, it's scary how much these berks feel that they can trample all over our rights.

 

[Stirlingsays]

In one way it would have been nice to have been one of those overpaid berks.

Plato's was right in the Republic.

You need people who can't be swayed by money, highly intelligent and educated and actually care about doing the job fairly.

No wonder it never happened.

The system is swimming in lobbyists and outside interests and the last people it wants are the above.

 

[silvertop]

Plato's was right in the Republic.

You need people who can't be swayed by money, highly intelligent and educated and actually care about doing the job fairly.

No wonder it never happened.

The system is swimming in lobbyists and outside interests and the last people it wants are the above.

Plato! On a football supporter's message board!

Right, somehow I have to crowbar Descartes into a post.

I will have to think about that...

 

[Badger11]

Plato! On a football supporter's message board!

Right, somehow I have to crowbar Descartes into a post.

I will have to think about that...

6S

 

[ASCPFC]

Plato! On a football supporter's message board!

Right, somehow I have to crowbar Descartes into a post.

I will have to think about that...

I don't tend to do enough shopping to need the cartes.

 

[Teddy Eagle]

Plato! On a football supporter's message board!

Right, somehow I have to crowbar Descartes into a post.

I will have to think about that...

Socrates was a better player.

 

[Stirlingsays]

Socrates was a better player.

Why?

Was it his method?

Be assured, I'm rather self satisfied over this joke.

 

[Teddy Eagle]

Why?

Was it his method?

Be assured, I'm rather self satisfied over this joke.

And what is the cause of this satisfaction?
Whatever his method Brazil liked it enough.

 

[ASCPFC]

Socrates was a better player.

He was in Bill and Ted's Excellent Adventure - haven't seen much of him since.

 

[Teddy Eagle]

He was in Bill and Ted's Excellent Adventure - haven't seen much of him since.

Don't know about Bill but I never met the man. Or had an excellent adventure.

 

[chris123]

Socrates was a better player.

It was the Players Navy Cut and the like that did for him in the end.