Physical Football..

[CrazyBadger]

In the fall out of the 'hair pulling' debacle or the ManU Leeds game last night, It's clear that football is strife with overly physical displays, with defenders hugging players in the box, or the defending team grabbing players, pulling players back on occasion throwing both arms around the player with the ball in an attempt to stop them..

My question is, How did this become acceptable in football?

Football is at it's core a semi-contact sport - where contact should not be intentional, but is considered unavoidable. The only acceptable form of 'intentional' contact is the 'shoulder barge', and possibly 'shielding'. But nowadays, it is most definitely being played as a full contact sport. Grappling and shirt pulling should not be allowed in any way. It makes the game ugly and limits attacking flair and skill, but it's so commonplace in every facet of the game that we seems like we cannot get rid of it.

The Refs try every year by saying things like 'more pens will be given for excessive contact' etc and we do see it being penalised often, but offenders get away with it constantly and everyone is guilty.

There was a moment in the Spurs/Sunderland game this weekend where one of Spurs players threw himself all over a Sunderland player (literally, with both arms) the Sunderland player tried to resist and shove him back, and he got penalised!

Can we ever eradicate this from the game? and how do we do it?

 

[Caterham]

For me - the ref has to stop this practice of getting involved with reminding players before the corner that its not allowed, just give the penalty for the first clear cut hugging / manhandling, whatever you want to call it - for sure there will be a lot of penalties in the first couple games of the new season, then when players realise that they cant get away with it any more knowing it will be penalised, it will stop them doing it.

 

[ASCPFC]

Arsenal being top of the league by holding everyone on set pieces is not a good look for the whole league. It clearly does not translate to European competitions either.

 

[CrazyBadger]

For me - the ref has to stop this practice of getting involved with reminding players before the corner that its not allowed, just give the penalty for the first clear cut hugging / manhandling, whatever you want to call it - for sure there will be a lot of penalties in the first couple games of the new season, then when players realise that they cant get away with it any more knowing it will be penalised, it will stop them doing it.

that's been done. It lasts about a month, til september, then is forgotten about for the rest of the season. and it's not just about that, take the example I gave earlier;

Sunderland vs Tottenham Hotspur: Should Brian Brobbey have seen red against Spurs? Jamie O'Hara has his say!

Porro loses the ball to Brobby, and then proceeds to jump all over the back of Brobby. What's Brobby supposed to do? Porro should be penalised for jumping all over him, but instead, Brobby gets a yellow, and people like O'Hara shout it should have been a red, and Porro is innocent in all of it

 

[Palace Old Geezer]

I agree that the contemptuous behaviour of some players has become something of a blight on our game. Clubs too, show utter disrespect for the rules - Arsenal are major culprits.

It's got to be down to the refs to demonstrate authority and punish players who continually push, shove and grab players, particularly in set piece situations. It's overtly unsportsmanlike and I hate to see it.

Wasn't there a situation one time when an assistant referee stood on the goal line for corners? An extra pair of judicial eyes might help to pinpoint the problem. I am no fan of VAR, but........

 

[Runningman]

Can you imagine a Leeds player from the 70s period having his ‘man bun’ pulled !

 

[Willo]

For me - the ref has to stop this practice of getting involved with reminding players before the corner that its not allowed, just give the penalty for the first clear cut hugging / manhandling, whatever you want to call it - for sure there will be a lot of penalties in the first couple games of the new season, then when players realise that they cant get away with it any more knowing it will be penalised, it will stop them doing it.

The issue is one has witnessed incidents where both the defender and attacker at a corner are both pushing and shoving, six and two threes and both players remain on their feet, accordingly no penalty is awarded.On occasions both players will go to ground but it is adjudged that both were culpable.

 

[CrazyBadger]

The issue is one has witnessed incidents where both the defender and attacker at a corner are both pushing and shoving, six and two threes and both players remain on their feet, accordingly no penalty is awarded.On occasions both players will go to ground but it is adjudged that both were culpable.

exactly, it's how the game has evolved. everyones at it.

 

[CrazyBadger]

Can you imagine a Leeds player from the 70s period having his ‘man bun’ pulled !

Like a player from Leeds in the 70's would have a 'Man bun' 🤣

 

[BromleyMonkey]

Can you imagine a Leeds player from the 70s period having his ‘man bun’ pulled !

Remember Norman Hunter and Francis Lee swapping e-mail addresses as they went off the pitch? 🤣

 

[Frickin Saweet]

In the fall out of the 'hair pulling' debacle or the ManU Leeds game last night, It's clear that football is strife with overly physical displays, with defenders hugging players in the box, or the defending team grabbing players, pulling players back on occasion throwing both arms around the player with the ball in an attempt to stop them..

My question is, How did this become acceptable in football?

Football is at it's core a semi-contact sport - where contact should not be intentional, but is considered unavoidable. The only acceptable form of 'intentional' contact is the 'shoulder barge', and possibly 'shielding'. But nowadays, it is most definitely being played as a full contact sport. Grappling and shirt pulling should not be allowed in any way. It makes the game ugly and limits attacking flair and skill, but it's so commonplace in every facet of the game that we seems like we cannot get rid of it.

The Refs try every year by saying things like 'more pens will be given for excessive contact' etc and we do see it being penalised often, but offenders get away with it constantly and everyone is guilty.

There was a moment in the Spurs/Sunderland game this weekend where one of Spurs players threw himself all over a Sunderland player (literally, with both arms) the Sunderland player tried to resist and shove him back, and he got penalised!

Can we ever eradicate this from the game? and how do we do it?

saying that contact should not be intentional is just wrong. Have you ever played football? It is a contact sport, you should get intensional contact on your opponent in the right situation.

the main problem I have with current players and game is that they will be aggressive in holding/blocking in the penalty area defending corners, yet the same players are throwing themselves on the floor at the slightest light touch elsewhere on the pitch. I'm happy for the holding/wrestling and strength side of the game to remain, but you can't have it b oth ways. Be strong and aggressive, but also be strong when you're getting challenged rather than feigning injury. It's pathetic.

 

[TheBigToePunt]

saying that contact should not be intentional is just wrong. Have you ever played football? It is a contact sport, you should get intensional contact on your opponent in the right situation.

the main problem I have with current players and game is that they will be aggressive in holding/blocking in the penalty area defending corners, yet the same players are throwing themselves on the floor at the slightest light touch elsewhere on the pitch. I'm happy for the holding/wrestling and strength side of the game to remain, but you can't have it b oth ways. Be strong and aggressive, but also be strong when you're getting challenged rather than feigning injury. It's pathetic.

Spot on. It will continue, and probably get worse, until the culture changes. That won't happen until pundits stop hiding and start calling players cheats. They don't, because they are employed as cheerleaders as much as objective analyists.

 

[beak]

In the fall out of the 'hair pulling' debacle or the ManU Leeds game last night, It's clear that football is strife with overly physical displays, with defenders hugging players in the box, or the defending team grabbing players, pulling players back on occasion throwing both arms around the player with the ball in an attempt to stop them..

My question is, How did this become acceptable in football?

Football is at it's core a semi-contact sport - where contact should not be intentional, but is considered unavoidable. The only acceptable form of 'intentional' contact is the 'shoulder barge', and possibly 'shielding'. But nowadays, it is most definitely being played as a full contact sport. Grappling and shirt pulling should not be allowed in any way. It makes the game ugly and limits attacking flair and skill, but it's so commonplace in every facet of the game that we seems like we cannot get rid of it.

The Refs try every year by saying things like 'more pens will be given for excessive contact' etc and we do see it being penalised often, but offenders get away with it constantly and everyone is guilty.

There was a moment in the Spurs/Sunderland game this weekend where one of Spurs players threw himself all over a Sunderland player (literally, with both arms) the Sunderland player tried to resist and shove him back, and he got penalised!

Can we ever eradicate this from the game? and how do we do it?

Return of the skinhead, a friend of mine had a skinhead haircut and eventually when that phase passed he tried to grow it back baldness had arrived his old "curly" nickname soon died out.

 

[Teddy Eagle]

Remember Norman Hunter and Francis Lee swapping e-mail addresses as they went off the pitch? 🤣

As the story used to go - Norman went home with a broken leg. His wife asked whose it was.

 

[BromleyMonkey]

As the story used to go - Norman went home with a broken leg. His wife asked whose it was.

Jimmy Greaves used to say that Ron Harris was such a nice bloke he used to put iodine on his studs before he kicked him and when the no tackling from behind rule was brought in they had to take Harris aside in training to show him a ball because he’d never seen one before 🤣

 

[Willo]

Jimmy Greaves used to say that Ron Harris was such a nice bloke he used to put iodine on his studs before he kicked him and when the no tackling from behind rule was brought in they had to take Harris aside in training to show him a ball because he’d never seen one before 🤣

I heard of an incident that occurred back in the 70s when a Chelsea apprentice was on a training run with the senior players on Epsom Downs. This lad ran past Harris who proceeded to scythe him down sending him plummeting to the turf ! Probably not impressed by being overtaken by the youngster !!

 

[Frickin Saweet]

Spot on. It will continue, and probably get worse, until the culture changes. That won't happen until pundits stop hiding and start calling players cheats. They don't, because they are employed as cheerleaders as much as objective analyists.

It should be utterly embarrassing for the world to know that you pretended to be hurt and rolled around on the floor as if you were in immense pain when there was none, and for there to be video and highlights footage viewed on a global scale of this happening. Somehow a generation of footballers materialised with absolutely no shame or integrity. It would take another generation to fix it and it would need to start at grassroots level but it won't happen as it's so normalised now

 

[TheBigToePunt]

It should be utterly embarrassing for the world to know that you pretended to be hurt and rolled around on the floor as if you were in immense pain when there was none, and for there to be video and highlights footage viewed on a global scale of this happening. Somehow a generation of footballers materialised with absolutely no shame or integrity. It would take another generation to fix it and it would need to start at grassroots level but it won't happen as it's so normalised now

Again, I couldn't agree more. I think the only excuse the current generation has is that it knows no better. Current English players have never played in any other culture.

Most managers and coaches are old enough to have played when football was different, but they are under massive pressure to win and will allow, encourage, or even teach whatever dirty s*** will gain their team an advantage, so its no use looking to them to create a more honest culture.

Referees could fix it overnight if they stopped giving soft free kicks all the time, and used VAR to punish dives and exaggerations, instead of to search for minimal contacts. I think they would respond more if they felt they were under pressure to protect an existing culture, though. I don't think they can be expected to create a new one against the will of the football industry.

For that reason, I lay much of the blame at the feet of the current generation of pundits. Many of them are old enough to have started their careers at a time when the physical battle was a part of the game to be relished. Some of them did relish it. That's why its so surprising that they don't call a spade a spade when it comes to dramatic overreactions, tumbling under the slightest contact, etc. All they ever do is play with their silly video gadgets to find the slightest contact in the slowest of slow motions, like forensic detectives looking for a trace of DNA. Plus, as I said earlier, they seem unwilling to criticise the sacred 'product'. Sometimes the things any fool can see, but which they ignore or justify, are so ridiculous that they remind me of media analysts giving an 'expert and impartial' appraisal of the Government's performance in a state run by a dangerous dictatorship! It's almost Orwellian levels of wilful ignorance.

I still remember the first time, about 20 years ago, when I heard Shearer spout that 'the forward has the right to go down there' about some minimal contact in the box. Instead of challenging him on where exactly this 'right' to cheat is enshrined, his golf buddies just nodded along. And that's a former England captain, and a proper old school No9 saying it. What chance have you got?

As you say, it is now normalised. That's because every time it happens, they say nothing, even though we can all see it.

Football has never been fully rid of diving, exaggerations, and shithousery. You can find it in any point in the game's modern history. The thing that has changed is just how often and regularly it happens, and how little anyone with a voice seems to view it as a problem.

 

[CrazyBadger]

saying that contact should not be intentional is just wrong. Have you ever played football? It is a contact sport, you should get intensional contact on your opponent in the right situation.

the main problem I have with current players and game is that they will be aggressive in holding/blocking in the penalty area defending corners, yet the same players are throwing themselves on the floor at the slightest light touch elsewhere on the pitch. I'm happy for the holding/wrestling and strength side of the game to remain, but you can't have it b oth ways. Be strong and aggressive, but also be strong when you're getting challenged rather than feigning injury. It's pathetic.

There is no reason to intentionally make contact with another player, except for in the 'Shoulder charge'. That is not to say that there shouldn't be any contact, as in many of the actions in football contact is inevitable. Even in a tackle(sliding or otherwise) should be non-contact; A 'clean' tackle should not touch the other player. Demonstrated by the fact that 'going through' a player to get the ball results in a foul.

You've actually highlighted my point in that the majority of people think of it as a contact sport, and it has evolved that way. I also I agree with you in that football is played that way nowadays. But it shouldn't be. Grabbing, jumping on, pulling back. Excessive use of these tactics get penalised. But why should even the non-excessive versions of the actions be allowed?

Out of curiosity, Where (apart from the shoulder charge) should contact with another player be intentional? Even the act of 'Shielding' isn't intentional, as you are merely protecting the ball. Contact isn't mandatory.

 

[BromleyMonkey]

I heard of an incident that occurred back in the 70s when a Chelsea apprentice was on a training run with the senior players on Epsom Downs. This lad ran past Harris who proceeded to scythe him down sending him plummeting to the turf ! Probably not impressed by being overtaken by the youngster !!

🤣🤣

I’ve got an old video that I put on dvd of some of our classic games from the big match in the 70’s and it was when we beat Chelsea on jim cannons debut, Derek Possee tried to steam into Harris and Possee was left a crumpled heap on the floor with Harris standing over him clear as anything on the footage giving him the wanker sign 🤣