Glasner Out

[MrRobbo]

It seems to be a bit of an accepted reality on here that the players no longer fit Glasner's system, but I'm not sure I agree at all;

Munoz - wing-back specialist. Seems far better suited to a wing-back role than a back four

Richards - all of his best form for us has come as part of a back 3. Well suited to it, never looked half as impressive in a 2.

Lacroix - was signed specifically as a player who has excelled in Glasner's system at Wolfsburg -we've never seen him play in a 2.

Canvot/Riad - both young and unproven. They are offered far more protection defending in a 3 than a 2 - I'd suggest both would be very high risk as 1 of 2 CBs at this stage of their career.

Mitchell - arguably the most suited to play in a back four, although he has been fantastic as a wing-back for 2 years now.


If the alternative to our current system is a back four of Munoz Richards Lacroix Mitchell... I'm FAR from convinced that is an improvement.

Cant but agree. Our back 3 look good as a back 3. I think they'd get found out as a back 2.

The protection it offers is great, hence why its seamed so easy for Clyne to slip in and perform.

 

[Eaglecoops]

It seems to be a bit of an accepted reality on here that the players no longer fit Glasner's system, but I'm not sure I agree at all;

Munoz - wing-back specialist. Seems far better suited to a wing-back role than a back four

Richards - all of his best form for us has come as part of a back 3. Well suited to it, never looked half as impressive in a 2.

Lacroix - was signed specifically as a player who has excelled in Glasner's system at Wolfsburg -we've never seen him play in a 2.

Canvot/Riad - both young and unproven. They are offered far more protection defending in a 3 than a 2 - I'd suggest both would be very high risk as 1 of 2 CBs at this stage of their career.

Mitchell - arguably the most suited to play in a back four, although he has been fantastic as a wing-back for 2 years now.


If the alternative to our current system is a back four of Munoz Richards Lacroix Mitchell... I'm FAR from convinced that is an improvement.

So what is happening for the next few games whilst Lacroix is banned. We’ve got Riad who’s hardly played and Canvot who can’t head the ball and is just a youngster. We are going to get ripped apart at the back without Lacroix in the side.

Why doesn’t he go with a back 4, have Hughes sit in behind Kamada or Pino and Wharton and whichever 3 he wants up top.

Munoz doesn’t look half the player he was since injury and Mitchell can’t attack anyway so it’s not like we would lose too much by altering formation.

 

[CPFCSaturn]

So what is happening for the next few games whilst Lacroix is banned. We’ve got Riad who’s hardly played and Canvot who can’t head the ball and is just a youngster. We are going to get ripped apart at the back without Lacroix in the side.

Why doesn’t he go with a back 4, have Hughes sit in behind Kamada or Pino and Wharton and whichever 3 he wants up top.

Munoz doesn’t look half the player he was since injury and Mitchell can’t attack anyway so it’s not like we would lose too much by altering formation.

I could be wrong, but I think Lacroix only has a 1 game ban for DOGSO - my understanding is that it's only 3 games if it's considered violent conduct.

But regardless, if we're now talking a back four of Munoz Richards Riad Mitchell... that's really not selling it to me! Ripped apart sounds about right.

Munoz isn't more likely to find form playing him in a worse position, and Mitchell absolutely can attack.

 

[Phil’s Barber]

I presume that’s a typo and you mean can’t attack?!

 

[Phil’s Barber]

I could be wrong, but I think Lacroix only has a 1 game ban for DOGSO - my understanding is that it's only 3 games if it's considered violent conduct.

But regardless, if we're now talking a back four of Munoz Richards Riad Mitchell... that's really not selling it to me! Ripped apart sounds about right.

Munoz isn't more likely to find form playing him in a worse position, and Mitchell absolutely can attack.

Yes, one game ban for Lacroix

It’s only a 3 match ban for serious foul play or violent conduct.

 

[ASCPFC]

Yes, one game ban for Lacroix

It’s only a 3 match ban for serious foul play or violent conduct.

It's a one match ban for doing nothing then.

 

[Foxy82]

It's a one match ban for doing nothing then.

I wouldn't exactly call it nothing, he definitely tickled Cunha's shoulder

 

[Paul Salvage]

I would consider bringing Clyne (is he fit?) into the back 3 for the game Max is suspended. He has enough legs to get through a game and brings a lot more experience than having both Canvot and Riad in together.

 

[Lanzo-Ad]

It seems to be a bit of an accepted reality on here that the players no longer fit Glasner's system, but I'm not sure I agree at all;

Munoz - wing-back specialist. Seems far better suited to a wing-back role than a back four

Richards - all of his best form for us has come as part of a back 3. Well suited to it, never looked half as impressive in a 2.

Lacroix - was signed specifically as a player who has excelled in Glasner's system at Wolfsburg -we've never seen him play in a 2.

Canvot/Riad - both young and unproven. They are offered far more protection defending in a 3 than a 2 - I'd suggest both would be very high risk as 1 of 2 CBs at this stage of their career.

Mitchell - arguably the most suited to play in a back four, although he has been fantastic as a wing-back for 2 years now.


If the alternative to our current system is a back four of Munoz Richards Lacroix Mitchell... I'm FAR from convinced that is an improvement.

When you play this system as an attack option the starting place for the wing backs need to be much further forward than they are, that is why there are 3 CBs. but we don't, they start in a line with the 2 CMs, when they should be nearly level with the CF, pushing the oppos fullback deeper, we play it in a defensive way, the WBs are to deep, its ok when we are defending, but hopeless when we are trying to break down a low block, Pino and Devenny would be better options against poorer teams.

 

[Lanzo-Ad]

It seems to be a bit of an accepted reality on here that the players no longer fit Glasner's system, but I'm not sure I agree at all;

Munoz - wing-back specialist. Seems far better suited to a wing-back role than a back four

Richards - all of his best form for us has come as part of a back 3. Well suited to it, never looked half as impressive in a 2.

Lacroix - was signed specifically as a player who has excelled in Glasner's system at Wolfsburg -we've never seen him play in a 2.

Canvot/Riad - both young and unproven. They are offered far more protection defending in a 3 than a 2 - I'd suggest both would be very high risk as 1 of 2 CBs at this stage of their career.

Mitchell - arguably the most suited to play in a back four, although he has been fantastic as a wing-back for 2 years now.


If the alternative to our current system is a back four of Munoz Richards Lacroix Mitchell... I'm FAR from convinced that is an improvement.

The Wing-Back Position in Soccer: A Comprehensive Tactical Guide | SoccerEDU Read this.

 

[est1905]

It's a one match ban for doing nothing then.

I thought a straight red was a 3 game ban regardless of the reasons for the red?

 

[CPFCSaturn]

When you play this system as an attack option the starting place for the wing backs need to be much further forward than they are, that is why there are 3 CBs. but we don't, they start in a line with the 2 CMs, when they should be nearly level with the CF, pushing the oppos fullback deeper, we play it in a defensive way, the WBs are to deep, its ok when we are defending, but hopeless when we are trying to break down a low block, Pino and Devenny would be better options against poorer teams.

I disagree - I think our wing backs play really high up, especially when we have the ball - it’s a huge part of why we’re so vulnerable to transitions, and why that’s always so evident in games against low blocks.

This is Mitchell’s heat map for this season which I think says it all.

 

[Midlands Eagle]

I thought a straight red was a 3 game ban regardless of the reasons for the red?

Fortunately not

 

[Phil’s Barber]

I thought a straight red was a 3 game ban regardless of the reasons for the red?

No.

 

[doombear]

I disagree - I think our wing backs play really high up, especially when we have the ball - it’s a huge part of why we’re so vulnerable to transitions, and why that’s always so evident in games against low blocks.

This is Mitchell’s heat map for this season which I think says it all.

View attachment 2996

Yes BUT
Because we have been leaking goals, Glasner decided that we should be more defensive against the low block transitions from the opponents. Consequently having had a set-back v Mostar in the away leg, he wanted both Munoz and Mitchell in the home leg to choose their attacking moments carefully hence we saw little forward movement from them when attacking. It was all about controlling the game and it was successful. Against Man U we reverted to a more attacking system in the 1st half but the red card changed everything. It will be interesting to see how Glasner wants our WBs to play against Spurs.

 

[Lanzo-Ad]

I disagree - I think our wing backs play really high up, especially when we have the ball - it’s a huge part of why we’re so vulnerable to transitions, and why that’s always so evident in games against low blocks.

This is Mitchell’s heat map for this season which I think says it all.

View attachment 2996

I thought you would, Mitchell 28 games, 1 goal, 1 assist, he is a fullback suited to a back 4, Devenny would be better in the games we need to win.

 

[CPFCSaturn]

Yes BUT
Because we have been leaking goals, Glasner decided that we should be more defensive against the low block transitions from the opponents. Consequently having had a set-back v Mostar in the away leg, he wanted both Munoz and Mitchell in the home leg to choose their attacking moments carefully hence we saw little forward movement from them when attacking. It was all about controlling the game and it was successful. Against Man U we reverted to a more attacking system in the 1st half but the red card changed everything. It will be interesting to see how Glasner wants our WBs to play against Spurs.

Sure, there are of course going to be exceptions depending on in-game situations, but on average our wing backs play incredibly high up the pitch, as evidenced by Mitchell’s heat map.

 

[CPFCSaturn]

I thought you would, Mitchell 28 games, 1 goal, 1 assist, he is a fullback suited to a back 4, Devenny would be better in the games we need to win.

Goals and assists is a pointless metric for assessing how far forward our wing backs play - you can just as easily point to Munoz’ output which was 6 goals, 8 assists last season - enormous for a defender.

A much better measure of how high up our wing backs play would be something like the heat map you completely ignored.

Here’s Munoz’ for this season.

 

[Painter]

I would consider bringing Clyne (is he fit?) into the back 3 for the game Max is suspended. He has enough legs to get through a game and brings a lot more experience than having both Canvot and Riad in together.

Lerma is the preferable option, as he is fit again.

 

[Eaglecoops]

Goals and assists is a pointless metric for assessing how far forward our wing backs play - you can just as easily point to Munoz’ output which was 6 goals, 8 assists last season - enormous for a defender.

A much better measure of how high up our wing backs play would be something like the heat map you completely ignored.

Here’s Munoz’ for this season.

View attachment 2998

It’s no good having them up there if they are doing nothing.

The whole point of wingbacks is that it negates the need for wingers. If your wingers were not creating anything then no one would be happy, so why are you happy with Mitchell and Munoz’s stats since returning from injury.

Basically we are creating very little through these channels but we can definitely see the holes at the back it’s creating when they are forward and this is exactly what is being exploited by the opposition. Guehi used to read the game so well that he covered up for any weaknesses, but we look poor without him.