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Rachel Reeves

DanH said:
How do you square being a disciple of his with him being a massive socialist?
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Sure Orwell was on the Left of his time, a very different Left to what we have now. Even then he was very critical of some of his fellows:
"One sometimes gets the impression that the mere words socialism and communism draw towards them with magnetic force every fruit-juice drinker, nudist, sandal-wearer, sex-maniac, Quaker, Nature-cure quack, pacifist and feminist in England. . . ."
"We have reached a stage when the very word socialism calls up, on the one hand, a picture of airplanes, tractors and huge glittering factories of glass and concrete; on the other, a picture of vegetarians with wilting beards, of Bolshevik commissars (half gangster, half gramophone), or earnest ladies in sandals, shock-headed Marxists chewing polysyllables, escaped Quakers, birth control fanatics, and Labour Party backstairs-crawlers."
"If only the sandals and pistachio-colored shirts could be put in a pile and burnt, and every vegetarian, teetotaler and creeping Jesus sent home to Welwyn Garden City to do his yoga exercises quietly."
"As with the Christian religion, the worst advertisement for Socialism is its adherents."
I think he would be just as aghast at the Left of today as most of his criticisms still stand.
He was of course intensely anti-communist. If you read Orwell, especially his essays and letters, what comes across is his honesty and ability to clearly state what he would say "is in front of our noses". He was a complex and often contradictory man. I can be a massive fan with him being a 'massive socialist' - different times, different socialists - I was even a member of the Labour Party in the early 1970s!
 
georgenorman said:
Sure Orwell was on the Left of his time, a very different Left to what we have now. Even then he was very critical of some of his fellows:
"One sometimes gets the impression that the mere words socialism and communism draw towards them with magnetic force every fruit-juice drinker, nudist, sandal-wearer, sex-maniac, Quaker, Nature-cure quack, pacifist and feminist in England. . . ."
"We have reached a stage when the very word socialism calls up, on the one hand, a picture of airplanes, tractors and huge glittering factories of glass and concrete; on the other, a picture of vegetarians with wilting beards, of Bolshevik commissars (half gangster, half gramophone), or earnest ladies in sandals, shock-headed Marxists chewing polysyllables, escaped Quakers, birth control fanatics, and Labour Party backstairs-crawlers."
"If only the sandals and pistachio-colored shirts could be put in a pile and burnt, and every vegetarian, teetotaler and creeping Jesus sent home to Welwyn Garden City to do his yoga exercises quietly."
"As with the Christian religion, the worst advertisement for Socialism is its adherents."
I think he would be just as aghast at the Left of today as most of his criticisms still stand.
He was of course intensely anti-communist. If you read Orwell, especially his essays and letters, what comes across is his honesty and ability to clearly state what he would say "is in front of our noses". He was a complex and often contradictory man. I can be a massive fan with him being a 'massive socialist' - different times, different socialists - I was even a member of the Labour Party in the early 1970s!
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Agree with a lot to be fair. I quite identify with a lot of what he said and wrote too, and we seem quite diametrically opposed politically.

Probably a conversation over a beer rather then on here, but what do think he would think of the Trump/Netanyahu/Putin regimes? That side of the right to me is the exact kind of authoritarianism that he would have been against.
 
DanH said:
Agree with a lot to be fair. I quite identify with a lot of what he said and wrote too, and we seem quite diametrically opposed politically.

Probably a conversation over a beer rather then on here, but what do think he would think of the Trump/Netanyahu/Putin regimes? That side of the right to me is the exact kind of authoritarianism that he would have been against.
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He didn’t have much time for any leaders I think! He was a little anti-semitic in some his writing but that was characteristic of the time - I can remember casual anti-semitic remarks being made in Croydon as a kid! I think he would have admired Israel’s tenacity in fighting off Egypt, Syria and Jordan in the Six-Day War in 1967. Not so sure about now, although he would hate Islamic extremism. Pretty sure he would side with Ukraine against Putin and I can’t see him as a fan of Trump!
 
georgenorman said:
He didn’t have much time for any leaders I think! He was a little anti-semitic in some his writing but that was characteristic of the time - I can remember casual anti-semitic remarks being made in Croydon as a kid! I think he would have admired Israel’s tenacity in fighting off Egypt, Syria and Jordan in the Six-Day War in 1967. Not so sure about now, although he would hate Islamic extremism. Pretty sure he would side with Ukraine against Putin and I can’t see him as a fan of Trump!
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Us lot sat over a beer talking about this stuff would be an enjoyable evening I reckon. Wisbech would probably end up stuck in traffic.
 
Nutmegyeti said:
Or turn up on a motorcycle - like Judge Dredd shouting “I am the law”
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According to himself, pubs can throw someone out if they don't like them - so he might manage five minutes. The Boar's Head might be an appropriate venue for him.
 
Willo said:
It is generally accepted that the Conservatives made mistakes hence the heavy defeat at the General Election. We had lost the trust of the electorate and it has to be regained.
I believe it is likely that Badenoch will face a leadership challenge but under party rules this is not possible until at least 2nd November.
I did not vote for Badenoch at the Leadership Election.
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Did you vote for Truss or the lettuce?
 
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